1. Registration trouble? Please use the "Contact Us" link at the bottom right corner of the page and your issue will be resolved.
    Dismiss Notice

A 6 wheel chassis?

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by jbjeeps, Oct 12, 2013.

  1. Oct 12, 2013
    jbjeeps

    jbjeeps Member 2022 Sponsor

    The Idaho side...
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2010
    Messages:
    521
    [​IMG]

    I was looking at this picture from our Boise Ridge ride and wondered if it would be possible to build a 6 wheel CJ chassis that would look like the deuce and a half chassis.

    I suppose the rear axle would be a dummy axle, no drive shaft connected.

    Would you cut off the rear spring section of one frame and add it to the back of another or would it require some kind of new spring arrangement?

    Is it possible? How might it be done? What issues would have to be dealt with? Anyone already done it? Pictures?
     
  2. Oct 12, 2013
    Flexiheep

    Flexiheep Sponsor

    Las Cruces, NM
    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2004
    Messages:
    77
    I will try to dig up some pictures I have of tandem axle flat fenders. The .gov played with the idea back in the day and I have pictures from tech type manuals showing pretty good details someplace. The rear was set up like a mini 2.5 ton truck and the d18 had dual rear outputs. I can't imagine moving a load that needed tandem axles with an Lhead powered jeep though. Taking into account vehicle weight the jeep was probably better on power than an M37 or a deuce I guess.
     
  3. Oct 12, 2013
    wheelie

    wheelie beeg dummy 2021 Sponsor

    York, PA
    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2004
    Messages:
    4,242
    There may have been a prototype built during WWII. I recall something about it. Not sure how the rear drive axles could be set up. Look at a dual axle car trailer for suspension ideas. Some have a pivot bar of some kind in between the springs on each side. Not sure if that would work so well in an off road application on a driven axle or not. I could snap some pictures of one at work, and of our older 10 wheeler dump (read no air bags on the suspension) for some ideas if you're seriously considering such a build.
     
  4. Oct 12, 2013
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,784

    Normally with axles in tandem the suspension has either a walking beam with the center being between the two axles on pads, or two short leaf spring packages in tandem, or an air bag at the rear of each side of each tandem fixed to a beam attached at the front.............most tandems as you see there have the ability to drive both axles with a through drive shaft between the two that is air locked from the cab..............of course that truck also has front wheel drive so in essence is a 6 wheel drive vehicle ...........but I believe the carriers on most were open.

    Could it be done ? Sure...........Although adding the extra axle as a dummy would only be effective if you were running in an area that required flotation or low ground pressure , like swamps or such......On the extra drive axle if you wanted to miniaturize and build the drive components in the machine shop to size of say a D44-D60 sized housing that could also be accomplished. Might not be cost effective though!

    Steering on those is also and issue as they do not turn very well with that extra set of axles especially in soft material.
     
  5. Oct 12, 2013
    Walt Couch

    Walt Couch sidehill Cordele, Ga. 2022 Sponsor 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    cordele, Ga.
    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2007
    Messages:
    5,882
    chain drive the tandem like many of the old farm flatbed trucks did. When I was a young kid, I saw a Sterling sitting out in a field with chain drive tandem but don't recall the spring system. Google search shows several patents dating back to 1942.
     
  6. Oct 12, 2013
    Im a doughball

    Im a doughball Member

    Oregon City
    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2011
    Messages:
    207
    [​IMG]

    Ed Holbrook's 6wd CJ6
     
  7. Oct 12, 2013
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,784
    Nice, I remember Nick M mentioned that a while back...........is that the one that had some unique transfer case or something? So does it drive both axles?
     
  8. Oct 12, 2013
    Im a doughball

    Im a doughball Member

    Oregon City
    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2011
    Messages:
    207
    I think its a modified Dana 18, drives one rear axle from the factory offset output, drives the other from the PTO port. 2x6, 4x6, and 6x6 operation.
     
  9. Oct 12, 2013
    68BuickV6

    68BuickV6 Well-Known Member

    Norco, CA.
    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2012
    Messages:
    2,116
    Found an old post by nickmil from forums.off-road.com, from 2002! :shock:

    Referenced page:
    http://www.jollyjeepers.org/members/pages/eholbrook.htm
     
  10. Oct 12, 2013
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

    Happy Valley, OR
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2002
    Messages:
    12,244
    Ed Holbrook's is a combination of 18 and 20 outputs in a 20 case using the 29 tooth 18 gears and early Bronco slider gear to give 2.46-1 low range. Some day I will have time to build one just to see what it takes. Originally Ed's Jeep was called Trac-Too because he had it setup with tracks he could install on the rear driving wheels. He had dual brake master cylinders so be could skid steer the rear wheels/tracks. He had a system of valves set up in the brake system so he could put it back to regular brakes when the tracks were removed. He repainted it John Deere Green and yellow about 8 or so years ago and calls it "Gator Too" now after the 6 wheeled "Gator" utility vehicles. I haven't seen Kevin Cooper in many years now so not sure if he still has his 6 wheel drive Scrambler. I do have video of him somewhere around here in Moab, Utah during Easter Jeep Safari climbing everything in his path. The thing was awesome. All 3 axles had ARB's and airbag suspension on the rear. Both rear axles also had Warn FF kits installed.


    Sent from my iPhone
     
  11. Oct 13, 2013
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,784
    Wow.......that is pretty neat.......I would guess a little busy under there with two drive lines. So the front axle is offset to the Passenger side and the rear is centered..........and the front axle has a carrier bearing hung on it to support the two piece drive shaft going to the rear.......Ground clearance has got to suffer?.......but still a pretty neat achievement from some very bright old school Jeepers...........So the big question: How effective was it off road?
     
  12. Oct 13, 2013
    Rondog

    Rondog just hangin' out

    Parker, CO
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2005
    Messages:
    2,918
  13. Oct 13, 2013
    piffey263

    piffey263 Active Member

    Medford, OR
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2008
    Messages:
    1,214
  14. Oct 13, 2013
    Flexiheep

    Flexiheep Sponsor

    Las Cruces, NM
    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2004
    Messages:
    77
    The last link had all the pictures I had collected and a bunch more, very cool set. I have always thought the tcase would be the hardest part, get that nailed down and the axles and suspension would be pretty easy.
     
  15. Oct 13, 2013
    jbjeeps

    jbjeeps Member 2022 Sponsor

    The Idaho side...
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2010
    Messages:
    521
    Thanks for all the good info and links. That one of Holbrook's is pretty amazing. I have a couple of 2A chassis. One is going to be a dune buggy to ride on the sand dunes at St. Anthony. I got think that a 6 wheel buggy would be even better. It would be great to build one, but I can see it's a bit more involved than just grafting an extra piece to the rear of the chassis. Maybe someday.
     
  16. Oct 13, 2013
    wheelie

    wheelie beeg dummy 2021 Sponsor

    York, PA
    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2004
    Messages:
    4,242
    I like the tracked version. I still don't fully understand how the full size half tracks steer but, that's another topic.
     
  17. Oct 13, 2013
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3,784
    Steering brakes.............just like a Bulldozer, you apply brake pressure to the side in which direction you want to go, effectively slowing one track down while the other is still driving...........Of course turning the steer axle in the same direction helps but with the traction of those tracks in the rear ...........it will turn.
     
  18. Oct 13, 2013
    aallison

    aallison 74 cj6, 76 cj5. Has anyone seen my screwdriver?

    Green Cove...
    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2006
    Messages:
    1,922
    Several have been done....
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    And even one that steers
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    There are quite a few more. Googled "6x6 jeep" or something like that.....
     
  19. Oct 13, 2013
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

    Happy Valley, OR
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2002
    Messages:
    12,244
    The orange/red one with the stainless steel rollcage looks like Kevin Cooper's before he repainted it green and extended the cage all the way back. The frenched into the body sidesteps are a clue. His tub was fiberglass. He repainted it in green with that chameleon paint. Pretty cool to see In The sun but very expensive. His wife owned a body shop.

    Terry, both 6x6's worked extremely well. Ed's had a little issue on real slick surfaces like ice in the rear because it was too light on the back. With some weight in it performance was very good. We started calling Kevin Cooper's The Caterpillar (like the insect) because of the way the suspension and tires would conform to the ground.

    Ed's has kind if a modified walking beam arrangement in the rear, or did. He had a rocker between the axles but instead if a solid beam he had custom built leaf springs that rocked in the center. Not sure if it still has that arrangement.


    Sent from my iPhone
     
  20. Oct 13, 2013
    wheelie

    wheelie beeg dummy 2021 Sponsor

    York, PA
    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2004
    Messages:
    4,242
    So, what kind of diffs could be used? Cutting brakes wouldn't work with a locked diff, or would they? Certainly not with a spool. I would think you'd want power to both sides while moving straight ahead but, not while trying to turn. I'm still talking tracked versions here.
     
New Posts