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Green Hell...the Never Ending Project

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by johneyboy03, Nov 6, 2011.

  1. May 2, 2012
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
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    Jan 15, 2011
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    1,754
    A oem Cj at the rear already have about 45 degree inclinaison on the shock....what could be the difference between Oem and my possible set-up?

    [​IMG]
     
  2. May 2, 2012
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
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    1,754
  3. May 2, 2012
    TexasBlues

    TexasBlues JEEP-Hockey-Holic

    Marietta, GA
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    i like it johney!

    WAY to far out of MY league to ever try... guess im just not that creative...

    looks great!
     
  4. May 2, 2012
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
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    That's why i start whit a broncos suspension....the simplest one very easy to work with. You don't want to see all the draw i made for the big piece bolted to the frame....

    Also the rear is pretty easy to deal with, lot's of space to work with....the front is another story, i want to make something similar to the rear but there's the crank pulley in the way of the crossmember beam i want to put in place. The front trac part going to be a real pain in the ***
     
  5. May 2, 2012
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    I'll have to measure mine, but I know they are not that far from vertical. I also know its more important in the front than the back.
     
  6. May 3, 2012
    TexasBlues

    TexasBlues JEEP-Hockey-Holic

    Marietta, GA
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  7. May 4, 2012
    euroford

    euroford New Member

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    there is nothing wrong with laying the shocks over at an angle, and that configuration is a good way to maximize axle travel in rotation. but, the compromise is leverage ratio. at a 45 degree angle the movement of the axle will results in approximately a 2:1 ratio of shaft travel in the shock (varies slightly, but you get the idea). this is fine, its pretty much the same exact reason why they run trailing arms on trophy trucks and koh buggies, but you need to compensate for that leverage ratio by altering the damping of the shock.

    if you take a shock damped for a certain weight vehicle and designed to be positioned straight up, its going to be designed for a 1:1 damping ratio. if you then take that same shock and lay it over at 45 degrees as you show, it will allow double the travel, but only provide half of the dampening. if its an adjustable shock you can change the shim stacks, increase the oil weight and increase the gas charge pressure and your good to go.

    with shocks like you show, you can't make adjustments. maybe it will work out with those shocks, maybe it won't. you can always try it out, but you should know it may end up underdamped and you may need different shocks.

    the other problem with this condition, is that mounted in the center of the frame, the shocks have no way to help control body roll. you will HAVE to have a swaybar. the reason we can get away with not having swaybars on old cj's is that the shocks are positioned outside the frame and are able to exert maximum damping on side to side movements. obviously if the shocks are underdamped this is even greater.

    personally, i plan to do mount shocks just as you are planning, but i am saving up my nickles to purchase some FOA remote resi shocks and a currie anti-rock before i do so, thus enabling me to tune the damping and air pressure to make it work as good as i can.
     
  8. May 4, 2012
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
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    I did install a front sway bar last year...do you think i should need one for the rear too?
    Don't forget that oem cj have leaf spring at 27.5 inch from each other, will coil spring i will get a 5 inch lift and spring will be 38" center to center.
     
  9. May 4, 2012
    euroford

    euroford New Member

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    you can drive it and find out, but i would be inclined to think that you will want a swaybar on the back if you go through with the inward angled shocks.

    if your springs are soft enough to provide a good ride, they won't be stiff enough to have much of any effect on on body roll.

    i've swapped yj leafs onto my flatty, and without shocks it rolls enough that it would be completely unsafe to drive.

    also: really cool rig man! i'm just trying to add some info so you can make it even more cooler!
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2012
  10. May 6, 2012
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
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    Everything you guy are saying to me is realy appreciatade. It does help me a lot.
     
  11. May 7, 2012
    Hawkes

    Hawkes Member

    Nova scotia
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    Jun 18, 2003
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    489
    You don't need to mount your shocks on top of the axle housing, you could gain a few inches mounting them on the back side of the axle tube.
     
  12. May 7, 2012
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2011
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    Here's the weekend advancement.

    I've done my subframe that will go between body and body's bushing.
    [​IMG]
    A perfect fit:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    It give you a good idea of the lift a gain with the rear only and front lifted by pi home made garage lift!!!
    [​IMG]

    My front dana 44 halfway assembled. Just a first look!!!
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Here a good idea of what it look with rear suspension almost done.
    widnt is know 37" away than the Oem 27.5". I'm expectiong a 5-6" inch at the end.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. May 7, 2012
    Posimoto

    Posimoto Hopeless JEEP Addict

    Minden, Nevada
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    Aug 7, 2003
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    Lookin' good, johneyboy03. You are making good progress.
     
  14. May 10, 2012
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
    Joined:
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    Hum a little change on my project....will have a complete disq brake set-up on the rear....already have a mc and power booster from a Yj will need to know wich prop valve to use with this system.

    I'm coming back with scout knukkle because i'm having space issu with the dana 30 one....
     
  15. May 11, 2012
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Looks like your doing a great job. Keep up the progress! If you dont mind, here are some of my opinions on some of the factors you have mentioned thus far:
    Sway bar: If you use a stout (not scout but stout as in strong) sway bar then you are going to limit the purpose of a coil spring suspention(unless you are doing it for on road ride quality). I would suggest making your front sway bar (even the rear) detachable so you can unhook the bar from the axle when you go wheeling to optimize your articulation.
    Shocks: as stated earlier, i would also agree with putting your shocks as close to vertical as possible. the setup you showed is off of a toyota with lift springs which is WAY more stable then coil springs so therefore body roll is not nearly as important to worry about as it will be with your jeep with the coils. With this being said, I would purchase some longer shocks since the ones you pictured do not look to be long enough to allow full travel of your suspention.
    Again, just my opinion on experience and knowledge i have obtained so far. Your doing a great job on your jeep so far and I would hate for somthing to limit the jeep in anyway. Great build!
     
  16. May 11, 2012
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Here is a link for the sway bar kit with adjustable and detachable links. You could also make your own setup like this which i beleive another member on here has and has it on his build (cant remember which build though). http://www.rustysoffroad.com/currie-enterprises-antirock-sway-bar-kit-97-00-tj.html

    http://www.earlycj5.com/forums/show...-type-stabilizer-bar-build&highlight=antirock

    EDIT: Here is the link to the build thread for the home made swaybar system. He did a great job at building it. Had to do some diggin. Enjoy!
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2012
  17. May 11, 2012
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
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    I do have a sway bar stripp from a later cj that i adapt for my cj5. I already built it to be detachable so i can use all the flex i need with leaf. Anti-rock sway bar is a good idea but the budjet is going over is limit by now. I know coil spring are less stable than leaf but don't forget that leaf is 27.5 inch appart center to center and now the coil are 38 inch center to center. I agree with you on the fact about the shock angle...I not i'm better buying some longer but like i said for the moment the budjet is busted :(....

    For the moment i'm really having a hard time with the front trac bar...i've find a sollution but it will need some works on it...
     
  18. May 11, 2012
    TexasBlues

    TexasBlues JEEP-Hockey-Holic

    Marietta, GA
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    your work amazes me johneyboy.... i dont know where you come up with this stuff...

    looks great and i ll bet youll be able to twist it like a pretzel when youre done!
     
  19. May 12, 2012
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Well glad to hear that you have most everything worked out! Whats your plans for the panhard (track) bar?
     
  20. Jun 4, 2012
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
    Joined:
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    Hum guy's pic to come tonight or tomorow, lot's of work done past couple of week. Front and rear end are sitting on the coil, front shock are monted. I was having of lot a mess with the front track bar but i worked someting you may like. I'm planning to have 6-7 inch lift now that i'm using front broncos coil because the Tj's one compressed too much and bronco's one seem to be perfect with the weight of the engine and body on it. I'm keeping oem Tj's spring on the rear .
     

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