synthetic oil?

I use Mobil 1 in most of my vehicles, but my jeep is the oldest vehicle ive owned. Is there a downside to switching to synthetic? the engine has around 100k miles on it. I seem to remember hearing that switching to synthetic on an older engine could cause problems.If i dont use Mobil 1 Im gonna use Valvoline 20/50.

 

I run mobile 1 10w30 in my 258 with no ill effects. I would not recomend it if the engine has a lot of sludge in it as the extra detergants will knock it all lose and plug the filter.

 

mobile one will not hurt your jeep. Just make sure that you chaing the oil within 2k miles after you switch. After that 3 or 4k is fine.
I run mobil 1 in my 304.

 

Isn't it when you switch to synthetic slow and minor oil leaks seem to leak more? Sounds kind of strange I know but I switched in the past and it seemed that the motor dripped all the time and appeared to have wet spots and then when I switched back to conventional oil they slowed down.

 

I had a personal experience with Mobil 1 some years ago that made me a believer, I run Mobil 1 in all our vehicles. They are all 100K plus miles now and they show no sign of throwing in the towel any time soon. No problems with leaks or seeping gaskets.
For what its wort the 360 in my Cherokee has 100K plus miles on a rebuild running Mobil 1 and still going strong.

 

My son has a 99 Mercedes ML430 that I have run Mobil 1 0W40 in since day one. Oil and filter changes every 10,000 miles. She
now has 285,000 miles and no signs of stopping anytime soon. Good stuff !!

 

You can end up with leaks after switching to synthetic oil's if you have old seals in your engine. They will form a false seal of varnish that the synthetic oil's detergents will wash away. Most of the time I only see this on engines that people switch to synthetic oil's with lots of miles, and previous owners haven't taken care of. If you find leaks after switching, just fix them.
Jeff

 

Absolutely no ill effect to running synthetic. As mentioned...it can clean off the crud on your gaskets that have been slowing down oil leaks and make it start to drip. But if you gaskets are good...then there will be no leaks...if your gaskets are not good...then you need to replace your gaskets.

Oil...and related wear are right up my alley. This is something I could yammer on about until your eyes rolled back into your heads (don't worry, I won't). I have been involved in R&D of such things for many years. What I have found is this...
Nearly all modern oils perform very closely to one another. The only time they do not is when they are not changed as often as they should be. Some oils deal with going past the expiration date better than others. See...it's NOT the oil that wears out...the oil that is in your engine would be just fine for the entire life of your car...IF, it never had any contact with the outside world...such as condensation, unburnt fuel, blow-by, etc. It's the crud from your engine and the air that make you have to change your oil. So changing it regularly with pretty much any modern brand oil will keep things in good shape. The only slight exception to this rule is Amsoil...This stuff is borderline science fiction.
MANY experiments have been done using Amsoil...Some of them personally...some of them through trusted colleagues. I don't want to hijack your thread with them...Lets just say it's amazing stuff.

Anyway...Synthetic oil is a good thing, use it.

 

Wow, thanks for the great replies. Looks like Im gonna be picking up some Mobil 1 this weekend. Thanks for the help.:stout:

 

My dad uses Amsiol in his fishing boat, after paying around 10 thousand for a new diesel engine he figures its worth the high price. So if I were to use Amsoil could i get away with changing oil about every 5-7 thousand miles?

 

I had about 90K miles on my XJ and about 85K miles on my YJ when I switched them to Amsoil full synthetic. I didn't develop any problems or leaks.

I've heard that the additives in the synthetics clean your system out so well, that the "gunk" that is stopping it from leaking gets cleaned out and causes older engines to leak more. I'm not sure that's true, but that's what I've heard. As I said, I had higher miles on my vehicles when I switched and didn't have any issues.

 

Okay...here is a short story for you...I am NOT an advocate of going much longer between oil changes just because the oil is better...BUT, let me run this by you....
A guy works in an oil diagnostic area of a large diesel equipment manufacturer. His job is as follows....Companies that use their equipment send in small bottles of used engine oil from their machines ever so often...He does an analysis on the oil and will tell them if everything is cool...or if something is going bad in their engine...he can also tell if they are changing their oil often enough. This is to catch a problem on an engine before it becomes a bigger issues than it already is....
Anyway...He bought a brand new Dodge with a cummins in 2003... he has ran amsoil since it's first oil change...and was changing it about ever 4000 miles. One day...just for the heck of it...he decided to run a diagnostic on his oil at 4000 miles and see how close it was to needing to be changed. It can back just fine and was not ready to be changed....So all he does is change the filter and add enough to make it full....This goes on for quite a while....to cut to the chase here...he is currently at 82,000 miles without pulling the drain plug...and the oil keeps coming back thumbs up for break down. He does change the filter and add oil ever 5000...so technically...it's not the same oil as he started with. Either way...that is flat out amazing to me....Regardless of what his testing shows...it's not something I personally would try...But still...it's incredible stuff.

I have some of my own personal experiences with it...all good.

 

Amsoil has alot of good stuff on thier website, When I get the 134 cu in F head in my 55 rebuilt I am going to try Amsiol in it and the drivetrain . If you call 715-392-7101 they will send you some free product information and a cool little Amsoil Sticker! (-:

 

Still i couln't imagine NOT changing the oil on an expencive engine like the cummins. On my father's Duramax after 7000 miles the oil is pitch black from the soot, about as black as the oil from my 258 after 4000miles.R)

 

Thats pretty awesome, One could probably get away with changing the filter every 4 or 5 thousand miles and change the oil every 10 thousand...that would make the cost about the same.

 

Yeah...and his is black as tar too...it's just does not come back as bad. I have a new(er) Cummins truck myself...I would never in a million years try this...I run Amsoil in it...but I start feeling guilty around 5000 and change it...I just can't make myself go any longer...I think it's built into us from youngsters.

Here is another experience with Amsoil...this is a personal experience...My Uncle (Mom's Brother) is one of those guys that buys a new car or truck...does no maintenance on it...or just enough to squeak by. In 1970...he bought a new Ford F-250 4X4 with a four speed....In around 73..my Father did some maintenance on it because he borrowed it from him. Dad changed all the fluids...and he put Amsoil in the transmission...Just because some guy sold him some at his work for cheap...Anyway...my Uncle kept this old truck...He went through FOUR engines in it's life time...because he would just run them out of oil...he would never check it until it was too late...and he would actually take it to Ford and have them put in a new crate motor (back when you could still buy 360s and 390's new). A few years ago...it burnt up another engine (lack of oil)...At this point this old truck is pretty rough in general. I was visiting him and he told me to just go ahead and take it...So I did....I rebuilt an engine for it...and I figured that since the engine was out...I had better rebuild or replace the tranny....I pulled the top off...and I really should have taken a few pictures of what the inside of this tranny looked like...I am not kidding you one bit when I say that there was NO visible wear..AT ALL. You could not even tell that the gears had ever touched one another...the little cross hatch looking marks were still on ever part of the gears....The truck at this point had 319,716 miles on this tranny...with the same Amsoil in it from over 30 years ago. I put new amsoil in it...and put the cover back on. I have been slowly restoring the old thing for the last three years...I still have a long ways to go...But here it is.

 

I am running Amsoil in my K3500 and Grand Cherokee. The last oil change in my K3500 was done about 25,000 miles ago, BUT I have changed filters and done oil analysis, I also run dual filters with one filter being a high filtration unit. The Grand Cherokee gets a change every year and a filter about every 6 months, depending on miles.

BTW - Amsoil started the automotive consumer synthetic oil business. Synthetic oils were first used by the military in their jet engines. Amsoil took that and applied it to the automotive market.

 

Yeah....here's a short story on it for those who find it interesting.


The Development of Synthesized Motor Oils
A Historical Review

by Ed Newman
Marketing & Advertising Manager, AMSOIL INC.

AS THE YEAR 2000 APPROACHES, it is both a time of looking forward, and of looking back. No one a century ago could have foreseen the rapid transformations that science and invention would bring to our world. From rocket ships to microwaves, silicon chips to Dolly the cloned ewe -- it has been an astonishing period of history. I mean, a hundred years ago we didn't even have gas stations. Or highways. Or flat tires.

One of the transforming developments of our century has been the discovery of the process of organic synthesis, the combining of the raw materials of production into a nearly limitless array of plastics, films, fabrics and fluids. By understanding the geometry of organic compounds, chemists could create customized molecular designs to achieve preconceived objectives. Scientists realized that they could actually improve the characteristics of items found in nature.

One bi-product of this process has been the development of synthetic motor oil. It is believed that the first synthesized hydrocarbons were created by Friedel & Crafts in 1877 using Aluminum TriChrloride as the catalyst. Yet it wasn't until 1929 that the commercial development of synthesized hydrocarbons was undertaken by Standard Oil of Indiana. Not surprisingly there was a lack of demand for the new product and this first marketplace introduction of synthetic lubricants was commercially unsuccessful. (There is probably no relationship between this event and collapse of stock market later that year.)

Eight years later the first PAO, a synthetic product using olefin polymerization, was manufactured. 1937 was also year that the Zurich Aviation Congress became interested in ester based lubricant technology. From 1938 to 1944 thousands of esters were evaluated in Germany with excellent results. In our own country ester basestocks were also being developed by the United States Naval Research Laboratory and introduced into military aviation applications during the 1940's.

During this period scientists were well funded, and the new processes of synthetic creation had some great success. But as is so often the case, the existence of a "better mousetrap" does not always result in its commercial survival.

It was the space age that helped create a greater appreciation for the benefits of synthetic lubricants. Jet engines raised the bar on what was required of a lubricant. The high speed, high heat and cold temperature performance requirements of modern jets created a demand for a new kind of lubricant.

Just after the war we saw the first use of diesters by the British in turboprop engines for high temperature performance. And from the late forties to the early seventies various synthetic fluids were developed to meet the demands of new and more efficient high performance engines and machines.

Because of the self-evident cold weather benefits of synthetic jet engine oil, it would not have been difficult to find a few maverick pilots experimenting with this oil in their cars. The military paid thirty-five dollars a quart for synthetic oil in those days and even the used jet engine oil seemed clean enough for some pilots in Alaska and elsewhere to mix with their motor oil to assist cold winter starts.

One such experimenter took a more systematic approach. In the mid-1960's, Lt. Col. Albert J. Amatuzio, jet fighter squadron commander at a northern Minnesota airbase, likewise had become familiar with these "extra ordinary" lubricants that protected the engines of the jets he flew. He began a research project that eventually became his life work and second career. At first, Amatuzio's efforts were aimed at improving the performance of petroleum oil.

Eventually, Amatuzio realized the need to begin with a synthetic basetock and build his ideal lubricant from the ground up. His search led him to Monsanto, Drew Chemical Corporation and Hatco. It was Drew Chemical Corporation in Boonton, New Jersey, where the first polyol esters had been developed and patented in conjunction with Mobil Chemical in 1958. Mobil Oil's Jet Engine Oil II was based on the fluids produced at Drew Chemical. The truth is, automobiles put even more stress on a lubricant than jet engines because air aspirated car engines must deal with dirt and the messy by-products of combustion. The problem was how to bring the expanded temperature range performance, wear protection and service life of a synthetic into an automotive setting. Amatuzio believed he had found a way. According to Jack Arotta, a Duluth Minnesota businessman today, "I was the first guy to put it (a specially formulated 100% synthetic motor oil) in a brand new car, a 1966 Ford Station Wagon. Al was my squadron commander up at the air base, so I always use the joke that since Al was my squadron commander, how could I not put it in when he told me to?"

Actually, for more than a year Jack had been putting a variety of Al's synthetic formulations in his previous cars, so he did not feel that he was putting his vehicle at serious risk. After several more years of fine tuning his formulation, AMZOIL (Amatuzio-oil) was created and became the first 100% synthetic diester based engine oil to pass the API sequence tests and receive API qualification in 1972.

The following year Mobil Oil began marketing the first PAO based engine oil overseas and in 1975 they began test marketing a synthetic PAO based synthetic in the U.S. called Mobil 1.

Over time a growing niche of consumers became aware of the performance benefits synthetic offered. As additional products were developed, from synthetic diesel oil to two cycle oils, synthetic transmission fluids and gear lubes, so grew the interest. With growing market opportunity, more companies made contributions in the development of basestock fluids and new technologies, including the Gulf Oil Company (since acquired by Chevron), Chevron Corporation, Amoco, Ethyl Corporation, Exxon, Henkel, Castrol, Uniroyal, Lubrizol, Neste Chemical, and Texaco (additive technology and synfluids since acquired by Ethyl).

By the mid-nineties nearly every oil company carried a high end synthetic motor oil in its product line, though only a few companies seem truly dedicated to promoting them. Nevertheless, synthetic lubricants are currently the fastest growing segment of the oil industry and they are definitely here for the long haul.

 

Thanks for all the information...I want your truck:drool:

 

is 20-50 the recommended viscosity for the 258?

mike s.