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4 Speed Identification

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by Norcal69, Nov 8, 2019.

  1. Nov 8, 2019
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2019 Sponsor

    Cottonwood, Ca
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    What do you guys think this 4 speed/D20 with parking brake came out of?
    Any guesses as to the first gear ratio?
    T98? T18?
    I realize that the only way to positively ID the first gear would be open the top and count the teeth.
    No reverse light top cover so it's not a t19...

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Nov 8, 2019
    tomtom

    tomtom Sponsor Sponsor

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    You could put it in first and TC high and count how many turns of the input shaft to 1 turn of the output shaft.
     
  3. Nov 8, 2019
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Volvophilic

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  4. Nov 8, 2019
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

    St. Charles,...
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    AFAIK the D20 park brake was only used prior to 1972.
    The shift tower and vintage says it's a a T98 and that means its 6.32 ratio .
    The shorter main drive suggest likely from a Jeepster or possibly a Wagoneer.
    J truck main drives are typically long.
     
  5. Nov 8, 2019
    timgr

    timgr Jeepin' Nerd Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    Looks like there's a tag. I'd guess early J-series, which could be either T-98 or T-18. A six cylinder J-series main drive gear is short, so seems that does not tell you anything. No difference between J-truck and Wagoneer transmissions when similarly equipped. Look at the tag. It will say T-18 or T-98, and a Jeep PN. I could probably ID it from the PN. Regardless T-98 or T-18 or 13-01 (also T-18) will be cast into the driver's side of the case.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2019
  6. Nov 8, 2019
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2019 Sponsor

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    So you guys are saying this is something that I should pick up if it's priced right?:D
     
  7. Nov 8, 2019
    timgr

    timgr Jeepin' Nerd Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    I would pass if it's a T-98. Otherwise, sure.

    Actually, the T-98 main shaft and adapter may work to convert a Ford T-18 with some minor machining. I'd have to search old posts or hear it from Nick, but it's possible.
     
  8. Nov 8, 2019
    Rich M.

    Rich M. Shoe pusher

    Maryland
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    Garbage but I'll take it off your hands :ninja:
     
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  9. Nov 8, 2019
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Volvophilic

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    How much?

    That might be worth good money to someone.
     
  10. Nov 8, 2019
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Volvophilic

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    Found it. :sneak:
    I say buy it. :watch:
     
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  11. Nov 8, 2019
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2019 Sponsor

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    At that Price?
    I don't trust the sellers description...... that's why I asked here.
    I guess I need to go look at it.
     
  12. Nov 8, 2019
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Volvophilic

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    Hey, it’s not my money. :lol:

    I guess it depends what it bolts to. I’ve seen willys t-98s go for over double that, but what would make it valuable to them (willys engine compatibility) would make it nearly worthless to you.
     
  13. Nov 8, 2019
    Twin2

    Twin2 wasn't me Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    short shaft ?
    dana adapter plate (y)

    I've seen ad :whistle:too
     
  14. Nov 8, 2019
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2019 Sponsor

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    You guys start beating him up and offering $75-$100..... I'll look like a hero @ $200..... :whistle:
    It's just parts for the hoard right now.....
     
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  15. Nov 8, 2019
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs. Sponsor

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    I’m on my phone but hedging from that pic the input shaft is not a short unit. Looks more like a Wagoneer or Pickup version from what I can see. That doesn’t guarantee a T-18 however. T-98’s were used behind the 327 Vigilante and had a similar input shaft. You can’t go by the top as T-98 tops were used from the factory on early T-18’s as they interchange with no problems. I know T-98’s had a slightly different first gear ratio. I never did the math but according to Novak it had a 6.39-1 first gear ratio vs. the T-18 6.32-1 ratio. The T-98 main shaft and gears are different from T-18 and cannot be mixed and matched. You can however put all the T-98 gears in a T-18 case and vice/verse. The rear adapter will work with either mainshaft.
    Check the case numbers before you buy so you know what you are getting. that 20 output has pretty good value by itself as they are hard to find without the housing broken where the stud for the brake arm goes in. Just like an 18 transfer case park brake output housing. Very common to be broken there.
     
  16. Nov 9, 2019
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

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    Yeah my bad because the T98 is 6.398 not 6.32
    Anyway it's most certainly not the longest maindrive that most 1970 J trucks used (well over 14" long)
    And certainly not the short 10" -3/8 maindrive.(1977-1979)
    I'm guessing it was originally mated to a 327 vigilante or a 350 V-8 Dauntless ??

    It's certainly not a T18 shift tower.
    I say that because it has no reverse light switch on it.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2019
  17. Nov 9, 2019
    timgr

    timgr Jeepin' Nerd Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    The 350 Dauntless (Buick) uses a ridiculous-looking bell housing with a very long 'snout' at the transmission end, and also has a very long input shaft like the 304/360/401. I have not seen a 327 bell IIRC, but I expect it is similarly long. A V8 will interfere with the firewall in a J-series unless it's moved forward with the long input and bell or bell/adapter. Maybe it's a T-98 for the OHC 230? The 258 uses the same transmission as the CJ (but in wide ratio), but maybe the '65-71 232s are different?

    Note these trucks have 11" Bendix brakes from the factory, so it seems unlikely that Jeep would continue with the transfer case brake much beyond the first few years. Seems like a Utility Truck holdover to me. (Looking at the catalog later, the transfer case brake applies to 230-232-327-350 so apparently it was used as late as 1970. Surprising.)
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2019
  18. Nov 9, 2019
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

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    Interesting stuff for sure but...
    I just don't know very much about the FSJ's.
    Maybe its time to look it up in a parts catalog....
     
  19. Nov 9, 2019
    timgr

    timgr Jeepin' Nerd Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    I tried. There are 14 different T-98s and T-18s for these trucks '62-73, not counting the similarly abundant 2WD versions. If it's a J-series part, I could look at the book if I had a part number, but I've done the best I can already without any more info.

    Looks like it has a tag, which would supply the part number.
     
  20. Nov 9, 2019
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member Sponsor

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    My only thought input on this is the t-case shifter which to me doesn't look right for a J-truck.
     

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