Do I have to outboard the front springs

Ok, this may be a dumb question but here it goes. I am modifying a Dana 44 front axle for my 66 Kaiser. Are people out boarding the springs in this type of scenario just to avoid modifying tube length or are the much more complicated principals involved. I am concerned with how much axle can I have outside of the stock spring perches before I am at risk for handling or who knows what kind of problems.

 

The position of the springs also changes the amount of body roll. Keeping the springs at their stock location doesn't really gain anything over the stock axle width, except for side-hill roll over angle. With the spring placed wider, you can use softer springs and keep the same performance wrt body roll.

 

The axle is out of a 78 dodge full size, I have rolled it up in front of the jeep and the axle tubes are long enough on both sides that I can cut them down and use the original perch that is built into the pumpkin. I can't seem to see any problems with my plan, am I over looking something?

 

No, it'll work fine. Might be expensive to have the axle shafts cut down. Cutting the tubes is not a problem - I'd suggest you ask around for advice on technique before you start though. I understand that welding cast iron to steel is not trivial.

<edit> Yeah, as Dan said, the Wagoneer axle would probably be cheaper, since you only have to shorten one side.

 

I am still unclear on how wide I can go. 55", 58", 60". I was planing on 60 but that would put the mounting surface about 16.25" outside the spring perches.... sounds kinda spooky, doesn't it??

 

Isn't the standard track about 50"? That means an extra 5" on each side.

The Wagoneer axle is already 60".

 

Out boarding isn't hard, I would do that instead of narrowing an axle to work for sure. If you want the front axle around 60 inches wide, I would get a wagoneer axle. It would be a lot cheaper because of the custom axle shafts alone. It's easy to swap it to 8 lug too, if you wanted that pattern.

 

Stock width is about 50-51 inches. If I cut this down and have the axles made, where is the point that I really should outboard. Does anyone have a solid answer to that.

 

Stock width is about 50-51 inches. If I cut this down and have the axles made, where is the point that I really should outboard. Does anyone have a solid answer to that.

 

It would definately be easier and cheaper to outboard your springs. Thats assuming you can weld or know someone that can, although there might be some bolt on kit out there.

Full width spring mounts are typicaly 32" on center and jeeps are 28" on center or so. So to bolt a full width axle to your springs you would at least have to narrow it 4" on the long side. I didn't find it that hard to do myself, but what do I know. Of course you then have to send out the axle shaft to get cut and machined down. I think currie charges $65 or so an axle.

I used a chevy 44 and cut it down 10". It was 67.5" its now 57.5". Thats 3" on the short side and 7" on the long side. It worked out well for my soa and shackle reversal so thats what I used. Also has 1/2" axle tube wall thickness. With normal backspaced rims the tire sticks halfway outside the body. I have no fender flares and have yet to even be noticed by the police (well I did get pulled over, but he wanted to check it out more than anything else.). Its been a great axle, but anytime I need a spare shaft it has to be custom cut.



Going wider isn't going to hurt anything handling wise, it'll just look goofy and might attract unwanted police attention. Also depends on what size tire your going to use. It will be useless to go fullwidth and have little 31" tires on it, just the same its kinda silly to stay narrow when running huge tires etc.... I did a lot of looking at pics and checking out other peoples setups before I settled on my width. Kinda wish I had gone a little wider so I could get full lock to lock turn radius, but its been good otherwise.

I guess the real question is what are you gonna use this thing for? Is it going to be a hardcore rockcrawling trailer queen or a sunday country driver?

I hope I had some usefull info in my ramblings today.

Kevo

 

Ok, Kevo, this is the kind of info I am looking for, however I am still unclear as to whether you did or did not outboard the springs, I can't seem to tell from the pic either. Can you send me a couple pics of your set up I would be curious to see it.

 

Thanks everyone for your input, any tips on material or techniques regarding this matter would be welcome. I am also considering using wrangler springs up front and extending the frame rail in back to use SJ springs and thus getting the axle back about 6" all in an SOA set up as I cannot see putting the time into modifying the front pumpkin to accept SUA. I do have superlift springs with 4" of lift in the origianl 1.5" width but from what I have read I can't see using these. They are increadibly stiff, real kidney bruisers. Any pics or tips are welcome, direct email j.d.johnson@cox.net

 

I have talked to a couple of guys here locally that do axles and if you want to cut it down, chances are you won't have to get custom axles shafts made. So many different companies used so many different length Dana 44's that you if you find someone who knows what's up they can get you really close to the length you want on either side. For example your long shaft may be from a 79 ford cougar or whatever and your short from a 72 dodge pickup. Just find someone who works with axles and they will be able to help you out. Hope this makes sense.

 

Thanks OrangeCJ5, that is a big help, at this point I am kinda leaning toward outboarding, (which I was originally trying to stay away from, but it looks like the benifits are outweighing the drawbacks), then I figure if I shoot for the original wagoneer tube lengths I can use those shafts. I have found a real knowledgable axle fabricator that I intend to use so as you all know it all comes down to $$$$, how much do you wanna drop. It would make a whole lotta sense not to put my self in the position of needing custom axles made should I find myself in BFE with a busted shaft.... As a side note, I have discovered that you CAN take a tappered 44 and make it into a flanged. I am having my original tappered re-tubed (lengthened) and converted to a flanged w/discs.

 

No outboarding for me. Kinda glad as it would have killed my turning radius even more. I had some pics up on one of the recent SOA threads.

Making it so you could use a stock axle length is a definate plus. Wish I had done that. I know there are a few shafts that are close to mine, now if I could only find them. Problem with junkyards in cali is that there all picked over allready. Luckily with the way I drive I have yet to break a shaft. Eventually I will upgrade to a selectable locker and chromo shafts and I should never have to worry.

Kevo