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Bump steer with Saginaw swap

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by colojeepguy, Apr 20, 2014.

  1. Apr 20, 2014
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs

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    I recently finished converting my '70 to manual Saginaw steering. I have an Intermediate CJ box & mount, and a 1 piece tie rod with the double tie rod on the passenger side. I have 31x10.50x15 tires on 15x8 wheels. It drives great-steers much easier and handles good. The problem I'm having is bump steer. Not at high speed-I can cross RR tracks at 45 MPH and hit bridge expansion joints at 65 MPH with no worries. This problem occurs while turning at slow speed. For example, when I turn out of my alley onto the street, the wheel kicks back when I go through the drainage dip at the edge of the street. I haven't taken it off road yet, but I'm afraid this is going to be a real issue on the trail.
    Anybody have any ideas?

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  2. Apr 20, 2014
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
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    Bump steer is normally found when you have a large degree of separation between the angle of the drag link and tie rod...........and upon suspension travel extremes up and down will effect steering. Yours does not look to be that bad statically.......At slow speed going through a ditch I would think a steering stabilizer would help that................Have you checked yours out?
     
  3. Apr 20, 2014
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs

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    Not yet, but I will. I want to re-mount it higher up, out of harm's way.
    However, it's not that old, so I doubt it's worn out.
     
  4. Apr 20, 2014
    oddfirejeeper

    oddfirejeeper Active Member

    Hamilton, MI
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    are the front hubs locked in? i know i know a silly question but one that has to be asked
     
  5. Apr 20, 2014
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs

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    No, I have a Powerlock front diff, so I never lock in the hubs unless absolutely necessary.
     
  6. Apr 21, 2014
    Posimoto

    Posimoto Hopeless JEEP Addict

    Minden, Nevada
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    Checked your toe-in? Like tarry99 said, your drag link angle doesn't look too extreme. But you may have excessive toe-in or toe-out.
     
  7. Apr 21, 2014
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Toe is what I was thinking too. Never had an issue when things were setup right. The swap to the other linkages could have gotten it out of alignment.
     
  8. Apr 21, 2014
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs

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    The 1 piece tie rod actually pre dates the Sagonaw swap, but that still doesn't mean the toe is correct-it hasn't been checked in years.
    I'll check into that.
     
  9. Apr 21, 2014
    bkap

    bkap Gone, but not long gone.

    Tucson, AZ
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    I'd drop the drag link down to somewhere close to level. The angle you have isn't extreme but zero degrees is better.
     
  10. Apr 21, 2014
    Bruce Hamilton

    Bruce Hamilton oldjeeps

    West Newbury, MA
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    Nice Jeep! Great restoration and up grades.
     
  11. Apr 21, 2014
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

    Happy Valley, OR
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    This. I'd also check thoroughly things like spring and shackle bushings, all linkages/tie rod ends for any play, frame cracks, play in the steering box or shafts and joints going to the gear box, etc. play in any of these can create the issue you describe. I'd also check toe as was mentioned.
     
  12. Apr 22, 2014
    Long&Low

    Long&Low Active Member

    Geauga County, OH
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    That tightening bracelet on the drag link has the bolt going down, it may be hitting the tie rod bar, and causing an issue, or the dampener bracket may be making contact with the drag link. The angle of your drag link bar is not terrible, and I don't think that could be causing the issue.
     
  13. Apr 22, 2014
    duffer

    duffer Rodent Power

    Bozeman, MT
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    As others, I don't think the angle of your drag link is the problem and it shouldn't cause any notable bump steer. My experience with manual Saginaws in the rocks is that there is a LOT of feedback-to the point you don't want to get the fingers/thumbs on the inside of the steering wheel spokes. A bigger dampener is the only real cure short of power steering.
     
  14. Apr 22, 2014
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs

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    Hmm
    I don't like the sound of that. Maybe PS is the way to go...I just didn't want the added complexity.
    I've driven intermediate CJs with manual steering and thought they were OK, but I've never 4wheeled in one.
     
  15. Apr 22, 2014
    jpflat2a

    jpflat2a what's that noise?

    Hermosa, SD
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    Nothing wrong with manual Saginaw....had it on my Jeep for 35 years.
    Upgraded to power a couple years ago..life is good.
     
  16. Apr 22, 2014
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Nothing wrong with it - depending on your steering wheel, it can be dangerous to your thumbs or other fingers. My buddy from school can tell you first hand, he'll be here for Elk Season :)
     
  17. Apr 26, 2014
    RJ'sCJ6

    RJ'sCJ6 Member

    Gibson, LA 40...
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    If you have access to a go pro, try mounting it under the jeep to see what's actually going on when you experience the bump steer.
     
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