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Warloch's 63 Cj5 Build

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by Warloch, Jun 3, 2019.

  1. Aug 16, 2019
    givemethewillys

    givemethewillys Sponsor

    New Kent, VA
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    Interesting for you, or for us? I personally enjoy seeing how the work is done, and gleaning anything I can from the process!
     
    Tom_Hartz likes this.
  2. Aug 16, 2019
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    Sorry to hear that. Hope everyone feels better soon.
     
  3. Aug 16, 2019
    Muzikp

    Muzikp Active Member 2020 Sponsor

    Sacramento Ca.
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    What he said (y)
     
  4. Aug 17, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Dang - well I guess if I remember I'll take some pics of how I fill the 'problem' holes and have to chaise the 'thin metal'. Guess I forget some folks haven't done much of that, so yes - its NOT interesting for me, its a PITA :banghead:

    At some point I may decide to just cut a section out and replace it. I've got some real thin areas on top of the rear fenders that may come to that.

    I've got the two post hoist back in the garage and may decide to set the tub on the frame with it so I can finish patterns for the firewall. That and some other 'dirt' projects need to be done before the snow flies this year so I've got to do some balancing over the next few weeks. Sept looks like a train wreck for work with a ton of travel.
     
    givemethewillys likes this.
  5. Aug 20, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    So the plan fell out that I thought I needed to make sure things all 'fit' back together and so I could decide what needed focus and change.

    With all the floor and hat channel work, and this tub was never on this frame, I decided to mate them back up. The first thing was to put the tub on the two post lift and then run the running gear under it and check for mount locations.

    After much futzing around - I was off by about an inch up front and @ 1/4" on the frame. I figured that by going ahead and putting all the tins back on.

    This also let me do some real measuring and figuring for what I want in a lift setup. The suspension has about 2.5 - 3" of lift and these are 31s on the running gear. Unlike a flattie - I don't need a body lift to clear the air cleaners and help engine bay space. I do need to consider the placement of the rear tank and how I want to run the plumbing. I set a 2X on the frame to see what 1.5" would look like, and that's pretty close to what I want. I'm going to also recess the plumbing fittings on the top of the tank I build for this one to help.

    This killed a couple birds for me - I don't have to worry too much about the frame mount locations as I'll just build new ones and line them up with the tub. I'll also build them so it will be easier to put sliders on for wheeling.

    The rotisserie stacked up nice along a spot - and yes - the tub will be back on it before it finds its permanent home on the frame. I still have lots of holes to fill, wheel house notch to put in, floor pans to final mount, fire wall to finish, dash to layout and setup for the gauge set I have for it.
     
    Twin2 likes this.
  6. Aug 20, 2019
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    Sorry to hear that you had an issue. I’m going through the same thing right now. I measured a thousand times and hope that it’s in the ballpark. I don’t have the lift, so it’s pretty tough for me to put the body on the frame. ( did it twice so far)

    Can you elaborate on where exactly you were off?
     
  7. Aug 21, 2019
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
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    Maybe out of thread....but i like the car lift you have. I always wanted one in my garage but never want it to ba always there.

    So having a mobile one is a good thing.

    Was is the maxime height of the fork ?

    And how do you like it overall ?
     
  8. Aug 21, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Where I ended up being off was front to back - specifically the grill was back about an inch from where it should be. I think this is due to the rear frame mount hole in the bed on the frame were not correct for the rear floor pan holes. The 1/4" was just a bit of 'variance' of getting the front floor pans and the mounting holes lined up. I probably could open the frame mount holes and make it fit, but I'm not going to fight it. For me it's going to be easier to just do the mounts since I'm putting a body lift on anyway.

    As to the two post lift - Max height is about 4', at the top of the frames. I've got the pad setup inside the shop, and I've also got a set outside I can use the lift on as well. The posts have wheels so you tilt them and roll them, then bolt them into the anchors in the cement. I also like the fact that I can customize where I want the posts to be if needed with just another set of anchor bolts. While not tall enough to walk under, you can roll around on a chair/stool under the rig. I used it when I put the rack and pinion steering in the wife's mustang for the first time and it worked well.
     
    fhoehle likes this.
  9. Aug 21, 2019
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    Oct 30, 2005
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    The rear mounts for my 71 are outside the frame rail, similar to the front. It ended up being about 3/4" from the rear Frame mounts to the closed front frame mount. I took my measurements between the two and hope like heck its in the ball park. I did mount my front fenders, grill and hood while I had the body on the frame and it all seemed to line up. Who knows what will happen when I go to mount it again after painting.
     
  10. Aug 21, 2019
    45es

    45es Member 2019 Sponsor

    Naches, WA
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    Chuck, I didn't realize the lift was about 4' tall. What is the ceiling height in your garage? In your pictures, it appears to be about 8' high.
     
  11. Aug 22, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    I have 10' ceilings with 9' doors. The 2Xs stacked in the corner of a couple pics are 8' tall. The shop is 22x34 with doors on both ends (one 16 in the other end, 12 in the end this is being done).
     
  12. Aug 27, 2019
    masscj2a

    masscj2a Member 2020 Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Chester Mass
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    Warloch, nice work so far. You'll figure things out on the body mounts. I did a complete tub like your doing now, back a few winter's ago. It was a 46 2a, but I had made a very heavy jig table, prior to starting the tub reconstruction. I laid out all the holes for the body mounts prior to welding. I had to do all that because I was starting out with just the top cowl and floor boards. And yes, had to buy 25 various clamps and that wasn't enough. In the end, it was a ton of work and frustration, but damn rewarding to see the tub done. Keep going bud, your much closer now than when you started.
     
  13. Aug 27, 2019
    masscj2a

    masscj2a Member 2020 Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Chester Mass
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    I do have a question for you. What flywheel are you using for the 231 ef to T18 set up? I have my T18 built and want to put it behind an even fire 231. Just wondering.
     
  14. Aug 27, 2019
    Buildflycrash

    Buildflycrash More or less in line 2020 Sponsor

    Gulf Breeze FL...
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    ...and what bellhousing? and what everything else? I want to do this as well.
     
  15. Aug 28, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    I built new mounts last weekend - pics to come, but work has gotten in the way of 'fun' right now.

    As to the T18 mating to the 231 EF.
    Flywheel - I'm using a 225 flywheel that I took in and had a neutral balance put on it. I've done this in the past and it has worked well.
    Bell Housing - this is a standard 225 short bell housing.
    Clutch - I'm using parts from Rock Auto for a 78 CJ5, Sachs K1675-06... on the Blue '49 I swapped in a Centerforce 384180 that I really like. This was done after I built the drive train for this rig. Also - the input bearing retainer has been turned down to accept a Chevy Throw-out Bearing. I then use a Chevy Clutch arm as a part of the hydraulic swap with the swinging pedals.
     
    Buildflycrash likes this.
  16. Sep 1, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    So I guess its time for an update. I've been doing 'spotty' work over the last few weeks, and work is about to make that even 'spottier' for most of Sept.

    Last weekend I built the new mounts for the Frame to Tub. Part of doing this is to give it a 1 1/2" body lift. I'm doing that for a couple reasons:
    1. Helps clear 33s if that's a direction this rig goes in the future.
    2. With a rear fuel tank, it helps to clear all the fittings needed in the top of the tank under the bed area. I'm probably going to recess some of the fittings in a drop down on top of this tank, but I know from the others I've done it makes a world of difference once you get to it.


    I also did some checking and I'll have to address the radiator mount before I go too far on the engine bay. The water pump for a 231 has a longer nose than the 225s. Makes things tighter to the front cross member and clearance for things.

    This weekend I spent Saturday making a 'grid' on the firewall so I could get measurements right once I started building firewall patterns.
    Then I spent several hours cutting cardboard patterns after I rolled the drive train out of the way and removed the Grill and Fenders.

    Today I cut the main sections of the firewall. After I tacked the inside one on, I dropped it back on the running gear to check clearances before I made too much of a mess if I was wrong.

    The first one is the recessed panel behind the motor.

    The next shows the one on the drivers side where I added a couple inches that the swinging pedals will go onto.
    I pushed the top section inboard a few inches (I'll have to get my notes from the shop and add them to this later) to make it easier using the Wilwood Pedals. This lets the brake pedal clear the steering column easy since they are straight line assemblies. If I was going to keep the firewall stock, I think I would look at the Roxor pedal assembly or build a custom one where I could bend the brake pedal to clear the column.

    Now I guess I'm down to building that sheet metal press I keep putting off. I have my hydraulic press, but the width to work with is limited and I keep putting it off. I figure a 2 or 3 foot one should meet my needs and I'll build it to clamp to my workbench...since it's so light it isn't going anywhere I don't want it to.
     
    73 cj5 and Fly Navy like this.
  17. Nov 26, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Time for a bit of an update. Work has been having me on the road way too much, so work slowed to a crawl on this project. I have been doing some little things here and there, went through and cataloged parts I had/needed - at least what I could see so far at this point. Focused mostly on Steering and Pedals.

    I'll detail the Steering as I do it, but others have asked about the pedal parts, so here's a pic of what I'll be using:

    This is the EFI Module I'll be putting on this build - still debating the rail pump system vs the Command Module style:

    I have also been working on the firewall based on the grid I did above. This is where I'm sitting now:

    Not much to look at, but for the time I've had - it's progress.

    This Turkey week was supposed to be more, but I'm helping a friend by installing a Manual Saginaw setup in his 3B. I'll post pics of that in a bit.
     
  18. Nov 27, 2019
    jeepstar

    jeepstar Well-Known Member 2020 Sponsor

    Sheboygan
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    :watch::watch:
     
  19. Dec 14, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Well - here is the pics and process for the Manual Saginaw I'm putting in Jim's 3B. His goal was to make it 'keep the stock look as much as possible'. To that end, its taking me a bit longer than my normal build time on Saginaw's. I can normally do them in a weekend, if it's clean to start with, on a V6, tilt column (my 'normal' formula).

    Got a Spud shaft and base clean plate from McRuff - this box is not quite 'normal' as it's bolt pattern differs from others and power boxes. Perfect for a 'manual only' install. I did my own fit, drilled holes and cut bolts to weld into the plate.

    At any rate - here I am with about 12 hours work into it...

    Ross box removed - old column was cut because I'll be using the top on a custom plate to make the stock wheel bolt to the Speedway Hod Rod Shaft I'm using on this.

    My next step is to box the front horns and reinforce the front cross member(s). I did a bit of cleaning and then stuck a new 2x3x3/16 box tube in the front.

    After I did fitting, clean on the rails for smooth areas to weld to, welded the spring mounts better, pulled the C Shackles off (did I mention I HATE those things :censored:) to protect them from the heat, I go the Saginaw Box Plate installed.

    An here it is all bolted in place for the 'shaft work'... I normally mount my boxes higher, Jim wanted it as smooth as possible for the winch he is going to mount. I didn't have to go through the front cross member, but had some other 'up and down' issues.

    Eh - this isn't gonna be a straight line. This is the first time in many years I've done this on a 4 cyl... I drank those brain cells gone a LONG time ago so had to think it through again.

    Original plan was to take the shaft UP over and attach. This lower route actually worked pretty good. I only have to figure and mount my support bearing, drill the shafts for the locks and that part is done.

    Here you can see the Speedway Motors Shaft - it fits the stock mount for the dash and I'm putting one of their floor brackets in at the bottom. It looks like I'll be less than a half inch off from stock when I'm done. Measuring was a bit 'odd' but I am focused on trying to get the wheel back in the stock location.

    I'll work on building a plate to mount the wheel to the column when I do the support bearing.
    Column - Floor Mount

    Hope to have this done by the end of the week since I'm off, but time and other 'stuff' will tell. Work has had me out of town a lot the past few months, so the honey do list is pretty long...
     
    colojeepguy, 47v6 and FinoCJ like this.
  20. Dec 14, 2019
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs 2019 Sponsor

    At the foot of...
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    I'm interested to see how you mount the stock wheel to the aftermarket column...
    :watch:
     
    FinoCJ likes this.

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