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Kyle's Cj5 Research

Discussion in 'Early Jeep Restoration and Research' started by Kyle weaver, Dec 22, 2018.

  1. Dec 22, 2018
    Kyle weaver

    Kyle weaver New Member

    Hayward Wisconsin
    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2018
    Messages:
    8
    Ok time for some information on my cj5 hear is what I know about it
    Jeep serial number 8305 S 242334
    Frame serial number 171480
    Engine serial number 4J374007

    And what I am trying to figure out

    Are the serial numbers close to original numbers or perhaps the engine and the frame would be closer to a 64 or 65 and the jeep serial around a late 67 or 68?
    Im Not sure how far off the numbers can be and still be approximately original?
    Are there markings body changes dash or gauge changes that would confirm it's year?
    What is the paint color name or code?
    I think i can see where the paint code used to be on the passenger fire wall. It's a metallic green probably bell green or spruce tip green if what i have found is accurate but i cant figure out which.

    Questions comments changes that need made pictures of something that would help let me know I'll try and do my part

     
  2. Dec 22, 2018
    Dave B

    Dave B Frankenjeep '67

    Northern Minnesota
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2009
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    496
    Here's a start on what I see-- (May need correction)

    83 = Universal CJ-5
    05 = Open Body
    S = Smog (Universal)
    242334 = ??? 1967 or 1968

    171480 = Feb. 1964

    4J = F4 134 engine
    374007 = I'd place this as 1964
     
  3. Dec 22, 2018
    Kyle weaver

    Kyle weaver New Member

    Hayward Wisconsin
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    Dec 17, 2018
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    Thank you it looks like my research was correct.
    The paint looks original to the fenders and the tub.

    What about electric Windshield wipers when did that come into play?

    My next question is what to put on the title when I get it built.

    The frame and engine id say are close to matching i might be able to get a 1965 title and serial number if it's worth having one closer to the engine and frame numbers.
     
  4. Dec 22, 2018
    Dave B

    Dave B Frankenjeep '67

    Northern Minnesota
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    Nov 10, 2009
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    496
    Exterior looks like Spruce Tip Green--

    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
  5. Dec 22, 2018
    maurywhurt

    maurywhurt Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Western North...
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    Dec 12, 2009
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    I believe the electric windshield wipers came into production around August 1966, in the very early 1967 models. At that time, the OEM wipers had single-speed American Bosch motors that were mounted over the windshield.
     
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  6. Dec 22, 2018
    Dave B

    Dave B Frankenjeep '67

    Northern Minnesota
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    Nov 10, 2009
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    I believe title info. would best come from the VIN plate. Previous owners must have been using accepted numbers. I'd be surprised if the title wasn't from the plate VIN.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2018
  7. Dec 22, 2018
    Kyle weaver

    Kyle weaver New Member

    Hayward Wisconsin
    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2018
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    Is there anything that marks it as being built in 1967 otherwise i think I'm going to make it a 1968 when I get the title made sense it would have been built after june1967 making it a 1968 probably sold in 1968 originally just what my calculator tells me doing some math with serial numbers and date's not vary accurate though what is your thoughts on it
    I have to get a bonded title so all i have to go of of is the serial number. And make a good guess

    I have a 1969 plate that was on the front of it when I bought it.
     
  8. Dec 22, 2018
    maurywhurt

    maurywhurt Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Western North...
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    Dec 12, 2009
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    This may help answer your question.

    The Kaiser Jeep serial number document below shows CJ5 production in the second column. It starts in 1965 and ends in June of 1967, with a serial number range beginning at 233064:
    [​IMG]
    Since your Jeep has a serial number of 242334, which is about 9,300 units after the start of the June '67 serial number range, it's probable (based on the earlier production data figures) that the body on yours was built toward the very end of 1967, or more likely in early 1968. Either way, as you've suspected, it would be a 1968 model.

    It's certainly possible however that at some point the tub was removed from the original frame and installed on an earlier frame.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2018
  9. Dec 22, 2018
    Kyle weaver

    Kyle weaver New Member

    Hayward Wisconsin
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    Dec 17, 2018
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    Im thinking jan or feb of 68 but they built a lot of jeeps sometime after that going by the known numbers in the lost year's
     
  10. Dec 22, 2018
    Dave B

    Dave B Frankenjeep '67

    Northern Minnesota
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2009
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    496
    In simplest, and incomplete terms: Beside asking what you know about the history of the vehicle, etc.---a WISCONSIN APPLICATION FOR BONDED CERTIFICATE OF TITLE FOR A VEHICLE will ask for...VEHICLE INFORMATION---Vehicle Identification Number, Year, Make, Model, Type

    Then with the information provided, they're going to see what they come up with on record to match the vehicle-- to approve or deny. You'll get an "education" if you've not had one starting here>>> MV2082

    Wisconsin DMV Official Government Site – Purchased/received a vehicle without a title or other ownership document
    Also, there is more reading material (may not be applicable) at: WI Statues 341.268

    If I were you, I'll chase this through a ways to see if I could get insurance and license before going too far on the project--if license is desired. I don't mean you have to insure & license it now--just suggesting to be satisfied there's no unknown surprises later.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2018
  11. Dec 22, 2018
    Kyle weaver

    Kyle weaver New Member

    Hayward Wisconsin
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    Dec 17, 2018
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    I know it will take some time and be a pain i don't know it might be less complicated in Minnesota I did some research on WI a while back and it mostly takes a lot of time 6 to 8 weeks i think if memory serves me right till everything gets sent back and forth. I am trying to get as much information about it as i can before starting the process it will be a learning experience that I know i just hope im not getting myself into more trouble than I'm planning on. I don't know much history other than it had a Michigan 1969 plate and then sat in an old man's back yard getting run once in a while then the guy i got it from had it for a couple of years.
     
  12. Dec 22, 2018
    Dave B

    Dave B Frankenjeep '67

    Northern Minnesota
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    Looks like you are going into this "with your eyes open" and won't be too surprised! Wishing you the best--
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2018
  13. Dec 22, 2018
    ojgrsoi

    ojgrsoi Retired. Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Weatherford, TX
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    I agree 100% to get your title before you put much money in it. There are probably provisions in your state for non-op or title-only. Give that a try if you aren't ready for registration.

    I have worked with many customers in the past that built some high dollar cars only to find out at the end of the project that they did not have sufficient evidence of ownership to title the vehicle. They end up in court determining ownership via court order.

    When a vehicle is titled using a bond I would recommend using the year that the body looks like. On jeeps the body has insignificant changes from one year to the next so only a knowledgeable ECJ5 nut might know. The correct year is most important when the vehicle changes ownership in the future. A knowledgeable buyer may look at the chart and know the vin belongs to a 1968 CJ5. If it's a match you are golden.

    All bonds expire. That time varies from state to state. Once your bond expires go back to your DMV and request the "value limiting remark" (BONDED TITLE) be removed from the title. You'll probably pay a title fee but your title "looks" better to a future owner.

    Sorry for the :blah: and:schooled:.
     
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  14. Dec 23, 2018
    Kyle weaver

    Kyle weaver New Member

    Hayward Wisconsin
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    Dec 17, 2018
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    Yep 5 years of bonded title in WI before i can get a normal title. they keep the record's for a total of 25 years. i guess it creates jobs to have all that paper work in file.
     
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  15. Feb 4, 2019
    NCRenII

    NCRenII yellow fever Sponsor

    Far Nor Cal
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    Is there enough of the original parts to look for date codes?
     
  16. Feb 5, 2019
    Kyle weaver

    Kyle weaver New Member

    Hayward Wisconsin
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    Dec 17, 2018
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    Maby it's hard to decide what is original and what is replaced. it might be mostly original but it seems like a 68 body on a 64 frame and i don't know enough about them to decide what is what. On all the little details.

    It's registered as a 68 now i know that.:)
     
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  17. Feb 5, 2019
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor Sponsor

    Florida Keys
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    Kyle,
    Your body/tub is 1965 or earlier. This is based on the fact that there are top bow sockets on the rear corners. These were discontinued very early in 1966.
    Your body/tub is 1964 or later due to the fact that there is no battery lid cover on the cowl and no raised boss for the mirror on the drivers side cowl. These early features were discontinued when Kaiser took over in the '64 model year.
    Either way, the body is either a '64 or '65 (possibly very early '66 due to top bow sockets).
    I'd wager that the firewall tag has been swapped from another Jeep, and the rest of the Jeep (body, chassis, engine) are 1964 based on the 171480 chassis number and the other attributes show in your photos. If possible, you should title your Jeep based on the original 1964 Jeep that it is, not the swapped serial tag.
    I can supply more small details to support the Jeep as a '64 if you need more convincing, but the body and frame clearly show the earlier model year.
    -Donny
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2019
  18. Feb 5, 2019
    Kyle weaver

    Kyle weaver New Member

    Hayward Wisconsin
    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2018
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    Ok thanks the more information i know about it the better that way as i fix it up I can keep it original or return it to original.
    that is the type of info i was looking for before i started the titling process im afraid it's to late now tho but it might be possible to do a title correction later as i have it mostly finished up or find the right year vin plate with a title.
    I am curious what year electric Windshield wipers were first an option on the cj5.
     
  19. Feb 6, 2019
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor Sponsor

    Florida Keys
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    I bevieve it was '66 when the V6 was introduced. Many vacuum wipers were changed to electric even back in the later '60s because they worked so much better.
    -Donny
     
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