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First Jeep build! Here we go...

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by '72CJ5, May 30, 2010.

  1. Oct 7, 2011
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    I have a simple rule - if you need to bend the tie rod, your doing it wrong and need to rethink something else. I have never seen a setup with a bent rod that ended well.
     
  2. Oct 7, 2011
    '74Renegade

    '74Renegade Active Member 2019 Sponsor

    Fair Oaks, CA
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    I agree. There's got to be a better way to get the clearance you need.
     
  3. Oct 7, 2011
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    I'll try putting up pictures by this weekend of what im talking about. But as it stands, the front axle is too close to the steering box. The pitman arm sticks about 1 inch or so PAST the tie rod...meaning it dont work at all. I have my lift springs coming in the next few days which will give me some room and then i wil be able to hook everything up and turn just fine but soon as the driver front tire starts to compress, my tie rod will hit the bottom of my pitman arm. Soooo.....since im on a tight tight budget and i need to get the jeep out of where its at, i sort of am looking for the best and easier way to get the steering to work so i can get her back on the street. Thats why i was thinking about slightly bending the tie rod and the guesset the outsides of the bends for stregth. That way all my problems are solved but since I aint never done it or seen it, i wanted to run it by you more seasoned fellas. All i need is the tie rod to be pushed away from the pitman arm 1.5 inches so the bend would be minimal.
     
  4. Oct 7, 2011
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Here is some cruddy microsoft paint pictures to show you all what im talking about. Here is how it sits now. Notice the pitman arm sticks out too far (also the pitman arm, drag link and tie rod all run perfectly flat and inline with eachother at the moment).
    [​IMG]

    Here is what i was thinking about doing.......
    [​IMG]
     
  5. Oct 7, 2011
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Just remembered that my tie rod on my GMC is bent on either end to clear the pumpkin.....here is a few pictures.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  6. Oct 7, 2011
    '74Renegade

    '74Renegade Active Member 2019 Sponsor

    Fair Oaks, CA
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    Having custom tie rods made with the correct bend would be better than cutting and welding, IMO.
     
  7. Oct 7, 2011
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Oh no trust me I agree fully. I was not planning on cutting and welding my tie rod. I sold my old IFS lift kit to a guy and since he didn't have all the money, he owes me work for the rest. He is a fabricator with full access to his dads pipe and fab shop so if making a new tie rod with a slight bend in it like on my truck is somthing that could work without having a danger issue behind it, then I will have him make me a new tie rod with the appropriate bends and guessets as needed.
     
  8. Oct 8, 2011
    Posimoto

    Posimoto Hopeless JEEP Addict

    Minden, Nevada
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    I know GM didn't make that tierod and draglink setup on your truck. ;)
     
  9. Oct 8, 2011
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    haha oh no they didn't. A "custom" shop here in Hilmar built my steering.....only part on the truck thus far I havn't had to re-do. All "custom" work will be done by me or another wheeler from now on.......never by a pavement pounder again!
     
  10. Oct 8, 2011
    Patrick

    Patrick Super Moderator Staff Member

    Los Alamos, NM
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    Wow...I hope you don't off-road that truck much. That tie rod is way low/ up front...
     
  11. Oct 9, 2011
    Hawkes

    Hawkes Member

    Nova scotia
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    Jun 18, 2003
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    Full size 90's GMC/chev vans have the pitman arm raised instead of lowered. Not sure if the tie rod end size or pitman arm size would work for you. Tie rods like to bend, putting a bend in them makes them weaker, then you have to overkill the tubing size to have any strength like your truck. I can't even figure out why your truck has that bend.

    edit: Now I remember you have Toy axles. I have exactly the same setup and since the TG tie rod ends have a larger hole I used a CJ pitman arm and redrilled the CJ arm taper from the top. Drag link is parallel to the tie rod. I was going to use the van pitman arm but this has been working for 5 years. You'll have to shorten the TG drag link, the Toys have the steering box on the outside of the frame rail. Here's mine

    [​IMG]

    Uploaded with ImageShack.us
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2011
  12. Oct 9, 2011
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    thanks Hawkes for the picture. Could you send one of how your tie rod and drag link run together? My axle is a little further forward then yours which is causing my issue. And no, i dont wheel my truck often...thats why im building my jeep. That was NOT how I was wanting my steering but like i said...pavement punders and mall crawlers should NEVER touch a real world working truck in my opinion. And also Hawk, i agree with the strength issue which is why i was planning on adding guessets to the outter side of both bends. it wouldn't have to be a sharp bend like on my truck, just a slight one.
     
  13. Jan 8, 2012
    Raven

    Raven New Member

    Denver, CO
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    Jan 4, 2012
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    Hello,
    I just found this forum and am very intrigued. First off, very nice build thread, second, on your front axle, what castor angle do you have? I am getting ready to do almost the same build on my 79' CJ 7. Also, did you have any trouble lining up the front driveshaft from the output yoke of the Dana 300 to the axle?

    Cheers,
    Nate
     
  14. May 4, 2012
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Raven, sorry its taken so long to get back to you and everyone else here on my thread, but its been one of those years thus far haha. As for the front driveline, I have yet to cut it down to fit it to the jeep but from a good eye ball perspective, it looks straight in line with either yoke. as for the caster, I mount the springs to the original spring perches on the toyota axle, never took a measurment of it but can if you like. Also, thank you for the compliment on the build, its taking longer then I thought for sure.

    On another note, I have a drive line question for ya'll. Im having my shafts cut down this weekend and have a question. When I take my measurement for the shaft, with full weight on the jeep, how much gap should I have between the two peices of shaft? Meaning, with the jeep sitting there and rear shaft hooked up, how much should it be extended? Thank you guys again for all the help you have given me thus far!
     
  15. May 5, 2012
    Posimoto

    Posimoto Hopeless JEEP Addict

    Minden, Nevada
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    I jacked up the axles, one at a time, to full droop, then used a bottle jack between the frame and the spring plate to force the spring to droop as far as it will go and measured from yoke to yoke. Then put a jack under the axle on the pass. side and compressed the spring up to the bumpstop. I had to use another jack on the opposite diagonal corner to get it to compress that far. Then measure from yoke to yoke again. The difference between the two measurements will give you the total amount of slip you need in your driveshaft. Put your driveshaft in and measure it with the weight on the suspension and you have the "at rest" length of your driveshaft. With those three measurements you should be able to figure out what you need for OAL.

    [​IMG]
     
  16. May 6, 2012
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Thanks! Sounds like a plan to me. I just got my tie rod and drag link mocked up this afternoon and am having them cut down (drag link) and the new tie rod built this week. Down to the little things like adapting the toyota brake lines to the Cj's, installing a new clutch fork, steering and then the little odds and ends like new seats, belts etc. I'll put up a few pics of how she looks at the moment in the next day or two if i can.
    Also, I took a few dry measurments today and the rear drive shaft is looking like I may have to cut the entire barrel (fat part) of the drive shaft off to get it short enough. Could that cause any problems?
     
  17. May 9, 2012
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Well got a few moments of work done today on the jeep. Started to put on my toyota yokes on the D300 but need a puller to get the originals off.
    Posi, I tried the jack trick for a front driveshaft measurement and needless to say, I have too much drop for either of the jacks that I have. The first is a 12" bottle jack and that is too short and then I tried a floor jack and that is also too short.
    Its been awhile since I have posted any progress pics so here are a few I snapped today.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  18. May 9, 2012
    Posimoto

    Posimoto Hopeless JEEP Addict

    Minden, Nevada
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    Looking good, man. How wide are those KM2's? I used a floorjack with a 18" piece of 6 x 6 to jack up the Jeep from the front bumper. You can cut a piece of wood for a spacer for the bottle jack too. Just be careful with the floorjack if you use a piece of wood for a spacer. Be sure the rear wheels are chocked blah blah blah. I'm sure you know the drill. On the front you really only need to get the passenger side at full droop. I'm guessing the rear axle must be centered, but I noticed on mine that the rear driveshaft doesn't move nearly as much as the front. Also, with those springs being pretty flat the driveshaft slip really only moves a lot on droop. Not so much on compression. It's the big arch springs that cause so much trouble with the slip yokes. You might not even need a lot of travel in the driveshaft.
     
  19. May 10, 2012
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Thanks posi! The KM2's are 35x12.50 on 15x10 eagle alloy 589's. I figured i wont need a lot of slip while on neutral weight since I am limited to my up travel. I tried using my high lift to just get a decent guesstiment but i can get well over 12 inches before the front axle starts to lift and I have had one too many close calls and near misses with using a high lift that way. I will try again tomorrow but im thinking if I have 1 full inch of compressing room in the front shaft while on neutral weight, that should give me plenty of slip. I have a smidge over 4 inches of "safe" spline to use on the shafts.
     
  20. May 11, 2012
    '72CJ5

    '72CJ5 Member

    Modesto,...
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    Ok guys...while looking for my brake parts, i ran across a dude on ebay selling a full power brake system from a yj. Booster, cylinder and proportioning valve all together for 50 bucks. Now, that caught my attention so if i was to hit up the local junk yards and grab a full unit like that, what all will i have to do to get the unit installed and working? I know I will have to build a bracket for the unit to bolt to the firewall and run a vacume line, but what else?

    EDIT: Cant sleep so i did my own diggin. From what I have gathered in the last few hours is that I can get a booster and MC off of a jeep YJ and bolt it right onto my firewall. Since I have manual brakes, i may need to drill 2 extra holes since the yj is a 4 bolt design. Once bolted up, i run a vacume line, bend the brake lines around to the opposite side from where they currently are (yj lines attatch opposite of Cj's) and maybe a few fittings here and there to adapt cj fittings to yj mc. Since I need a prop valve anyways, I found several yj units on ebay complete including mc, booster and prop valve for right around 50 bucks. Finding one down here in the valley in a junk yard is like playing the lotto. Only jeeps here are mail jeeps, cherrokees and a waggy now and again. So ya, figured screw it...i'll install power brakes.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2012

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