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Fino's 58 Wagon

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by FinoCJ, Aug 10, 2019.

  1. May 31, 2020
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs 2019 Sponsor

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    Keep a close eye on that thing....i used to sell those regularly back when I worked at a speed shop. I've seen quite a few cracked where the 90 degree bends are :(
     
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  2. May 31, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    Posting some stuff here for my own future reference as much as anything else...but if you see an error, let me know:
    Have to begin figuring out the wiring a bit from the ignition switch - in the long run, would like to not have all the amps flowing through the ammeter gauge in the dash, and I don't just want to bypass the guage and connect the wires and keep all the current behind the dash...so a junction block and possible keyed power supply for a fuse box is in my thoughts....
    Thought this was part of the ignition switch wiring from up in the column, but it appears to be just the harness for the turn-signals etc. DelcoRemy D867. This is a common GM harness....don't know if jeep did the same as the upper portion of the column seems to be from a jeep (maybe a FSJ).
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    If my internet research is correct - the one disconnected wire is the black Horn wire so maybe will eventually get that fixed:
    20 Black Horn G
    18 Lt.Blue LF Turn Signal H
    18 Dark.Blue RF Turn Signal J
    14 Brown Hazard Flasher K
    14 Purple Turn Flasher L
    16 Yellow LR Turn Signal M
    16 Dark Green RR Turn Signal N
    14 White Stop Lamp Switch P

    Still need to dig in there further to find the ignition switch.
     
  3. Jun 1, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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  4. Jun 2, 2020
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs 2019 Sponsor

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    Does yours have a plug on the side of the head that you can use?
     
  5. Jun 2, 2020
    45es

    45es Member 2019 Sponsor

    Naches, WA
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  6. Jun 2, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    no - its the early head that has no ports (or any attachment points for accessories either). Can an o-ring vs gasket seal be used interchangeably on the manifold, or maybe its the thermostat housing that I would have to change? I need to learn a bit more about what I can and cannot use with regard to that.
     
  7. Jun 2, 2020
    45es

    45es Member 2019 Sponsor

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    If the part has a machined groove for an o-ring, then yes. Otherwise, you will need to use a gasket.
     
  8. Jun 2, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

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    guess what I am asking....the adapter/spacer has o-ring, but neither the intake manifold nor the thermostat housing have grooves for o-ring (standard flat gasket)....so does that mean I just use a gasket for both sides and ignore the o-ring aspect?
     
  9. Jun 2, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    Wondering if I could improve the belt drive system a bit as I am concerned about driving the water pump as is (although that is probably how its been for a long time). With the current PO set-up, a single belt around the crank drives all three additional pulleys (water pump, PS, Alt). Sorry for the low quality sketches, but they give a good idea of what I am talking about, and whether I should switch to a 2 belt system.
    [​IMG]
    My main concern with the current set-up is the limited amount of belt-pulley interface on the water pump. I am thinking of switching the WP to a 2 groove pulley and utilizing the existing 2 groove pulley on the PS pump and running that as a separate belt system. That would leave the alternator to work on the original main pulley groove and wrap the the belt much closer to 90 degrees around the water pump. Worth getting a new 2 groove pulley for the WP to do this?

    EDIT - I just realized that the 2 belt system probably won't work as the PS pump is a fixed mount, and thus there would be no way to get the belt tension correct.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2020
  10. Jun 2, 2020
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs 2019 Sponsor

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    No you still use the oring, a lot of the aftermarket Chevy tstat housings are made like that.
     
  11. Jun 2, 2020
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    Any chance you could add a tensioner?
     
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  12. Jun 2, 2020
    45es

    45es Member 2019 Sponsor

    Naches, WA
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    You have probably figured it out by now but my answer to your question is. The spacer has one side machined for an o-ring. This side would go toward the manifold and be installed with the o-ring. The other side of the spacer is smooth. I would use a gasket to seal the thermostat, thermostat housing and spacer in the same manor as the factory sealed the thermostat housing/manifold connection. Hope this makes sense.
     
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  13. Jun 6, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    Started the electric fan install...here is test mount using 4 straps around the sides to hold it in place...think this will work nicely with proper hardware and finalized, although thinking a 5th strap over the top to the flat front panel behind the top of the grille could be helpful with supporting directly against its weight - but it would certainly look a bit shabby (like that matters given my other work on this thing) ....time to work on the wiring a bit...still need to modify the electrical a bit more after the alternator install, although it will run as is.
    [​IMG]
     
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  14. Jun 7, 2020
    Muzikp

    Muzikp Active Member 2020 Sponsor

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    That looks good so far. You still have room to put the old fan on also, with both fans you might get better mileage as they pull you along :D.
     
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  15. Jun 12, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

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    Getting closer....
    mounted the relay for the electric fan on the inner fender and roughed in the wiring...after testing, if all is good, it'll get cleaned up a bit and taped etc...I am also going to put a junction post on the lower inner fender for +12V that will tie the battery and alternator together and provide a good take off point for high current needs on a relay (such as the fan). Am also putting in a junction post on the inside of the firewall for keyed +12V to switch relays, power the tachometer and eventually a voltmeter and whatever else might be needed. In the short term, keeping the OEM set-up with aftermarket 60A ammeter (from PO) to go with the 60A alternator I just installed.
    [​IMG]

    For the temperature sending unit for the fan relay - I went with a spacer under the thermostat housing that has 2 threaded ports - used one for the sending unit and plugged the other one. Okay, I might have done this wrong, but better to know now and fix it than have it cause an issue - I left the thermostat mounted in the intake manifold in the little groove, and put the spacer on top (with the o-ring down). Then I put the housing on top of the spacer with RTV (didn't have a spare gasket).I know Ed mentioned putting the thermostat on top of the spacer, but seemed like it preferred to sit in the groove/seat on the intake more than the flat smooth top of the spacer. The bottom gasket surface of the thermostat housing is also smooth, so sandwiching the thermostat in there would leave a bit of a gap. I left the thermostat in its original location I put just a touch of thread sealant on the first couple threads of the sending unit, but didn't want to use too much and cause any issue with the sending unit not grounding properly.
    [​IMG]

    As I had to dig around under the dash to find the keyed 12V wire from ignition, I also did some wiring clean-up and got some of the speedo cluster gauges working. Got all of the interior dash and auxiliary gauge lights wired to the correct headlight switch terminal so they come on with the parking lights. Replaced some of the bulbs, so the general backlight on the speedo is working, and also got the Amp light wired in and working! (I stole the 2-wire oil light socket as I am not using it - separate mechanical oil pressure gague). Hoping to get the Hi-beam indicator working - it has a new bulb and wired in, but I think I popped a fuse, or tripped the circuit breaker at some point - so lost the headlight functionality (forgot to disconnect the battery at some point in my many back and forth's testing things, and sparked the headlight switch with a screw driver). I think there is a circuit breaker on the back of the headlight switch that should reset? maybe there is also an inline fuse somewhere? I am not using the speedo temp gauge - but both the fuel and temp test like they will work, so at some point I'll have to drop the tank to see what is going on with the fuel sending unit.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2020
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  16. Jun 12, 2020
    45es

    45es Member 2019 Sponsor

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    That should work. As long as the thermostat is working correctly, the fan sensor should see the temperature it needs to control the fan.
     
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  17. Jun 12, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

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    Its the 185 fan sensor - so it kicks the fan on when it reads a temp of 185. Its designed to run with a 180 thermostat - so the thermostat will be fully open just before the fan would need to kick on (assuming the sending units are equally accurate). I believe a 180 thermostat starts to open around 160, so the fan sensor should have some flow to it well before it needs to open - at least that is what I am hoping/thinking.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2020
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  18. Jun 12, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

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    Another small step - got the high beam switch and indicator light working.
    [​IMG]

    When I got it, the headlights came on when the switch was pulled out, but not sure the high beams were coming on or not. I think the lights flickered when the dimmer switch was pushed, but not sure anything was actually changing. Based on how it was wired - I think it was just using a side terminal post as a junction block and connecting the wire from the headlight switch directly to the low beams. The high beam wire was on the center terminal (?) and the dash indicator was on the 3rd terminal and no bulb. I am not all the jeep or wiring savvy, but it doesn't seem that hard to get it right (with a little help from an old post by Walt - thanks!).
    [​IMG]

    Green wire from headlight switch to the center post, wire to low beams to one side post (right in the case), and wire to high beam to the opposite side post along with the dash indicator light to the high beam post. Pretty easy to check the switch functionality with a multi-meter to see which circuits closed when. Headlight relay may be in the future, but one thing at a time for now just to get it back to working - and probably some new wires from the fender junction block to the lights etc.

    Might be time to start it and test everything out a bit....:worry:
     
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  19. Jun 12, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

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    :D
     
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  20. Jun 25, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

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    Well, back to the never ending oil leak...been driving it around a bit, short jaunts near home, but went for a bit longer drive today running a few errands (60+ miles with some hwy and some moutains and a lot of 3000 rpm in 3rd gear to keep 60 mph). At one of my stops there was quite a puddle of oil under it....have a nice fresh coating of oil all along the front of engine, puddling of oil on the intake manifold, and oil blown up onto the underside of the hood. Its oozing out all along the valve covers, the front of the intake manifold, the timing cover gasket, and from what I can see of the rear - its pouring out there as well. In total, I am guessing its been driven 200-250 miles since I last topped off the oil, and now its a quart low again - and I think most of it is being left on the road....If its consuming it, that isn't good as well.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    What to do next....I am thinking its pull the engine and look it over...maybe I can just replace all the gaskets again outside the engine bay, where I have better access etc, but... maybe its time to tear it down totally....My old worn out 258 with cracked valve covers didn't leak this much oil.
     

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