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Fino's 58 Wagon

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by FinoCJ, Aug 10, 2019.

  1. Mar 30, 2020
    shadetreetim

    shadetreetim Member 2020 Sponsor

    Riverside, Ca
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2019
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    95
    I'm having a hard time reading this thread, I keep daydreaming of owning a wagon. Nice project.

    Back in the late 70's my older brother had put a '60 283 in his 67' Chevelle while he built a bigger motor. When the new motor was ready he went out and tried to blow the 283 up by revving the crap out of it while racing around town. He finally gave up and pulled the 283 out still intact. Lot of respect for those motors.
     
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  2. Mar 30, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
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    It will be sweeter if I can ever get it running reliably....So much I want to do, so little money and skill...
     
  3. Mar 30, 2020
    Dave Deyton

    Dave Deyton Member

    Fuquay-Varina, NC
    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2003
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    318
    I really enjoy reading this thread. I know these projects can eat up a lot of money, but you're doing it right.
    You really do have the skills, what a cool project. Got to get up to Colorado, great scenery, great people, and great Jeeps.


    Dave
     
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  4. Apr 1, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
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    The brake project is done to the point of bleeding and testing....I use some thread sealant on the flare fittings that I wanted to let cure a bit, and maybe I just don't want to find out I need to redo something....looking for something to do that doesn't require me to spend so much time here (my wife apparently took a pic of me since that is shere I seem to spend all my time):
    [​IMG]

    So on to another project....for a bit...
     
  5. Apr 1, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
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    2,876
    Radiator shroud....Looking back in this thread you can see I replaced the radiator it came with which was not original (was seeping and did not fit very well)...We had some discussion on here on how to best mount the new radiator as there was a big gap between the radiator and the fan...I put a spacer behind the fan moving it forward, and also used some spacers to move the radiator back...although it stays plenty cool when moving along, it wasn't quite enough to keep it cool when sitting in stop and go (mostly stop) traffic around here...So a fan shroud is needed and with the radiator out for the brake line work, now is a good time to do it...
    Here was the homebrew shroud it came with from PO - which is now long gone...discarded along with the old radiator.
    [​IMG]

    I used a universal shroud kit with the push-through pins, did some slight modifications to the shroud and got it mounted on the radiator...With the sbc swap, the fan is low and quite off-center to the passenger side of the radiator...
    [​IMG]

    After doing it, here are my thoughts: I don't mind the push-pin part so much, and the light shroud is solidly held in place...but the plastic threads and washers leave a lot to be desired. It doesn't take much to destroy/strip the plastic threads and wonder how long they will hold the shroud in place. Thinking of replacing the plastic push-pin with some small machine screws or like 1/4" bolts and better washers to go with the rubber washers and wing nuts - or maybe just use some nylock nuts in place of the wing nuts. Now that the plastic push pin has safely made the the 'hole' through the fins, it would be simple to replace with something a bit stronger. Of course, new bolts requires a trip to the hardware store....not my favorite activity right now...
    Its not perfect, but I think its pretty good and hopefully it won't take much to keep it cool....
    [​IMG]

    With the radiator moved to the proper forward position, the blade sits about right in terms of depth - the edge is right about half the blade:
    [​IMG]

    And I probably have a bit too much gap around the outside circumference - its probably 1.5-2" instead of 1" but still seems pretty good:
    [​IMG]

    Moving the radiator forward to its proper mounting position has some benefits:
    1) keeps fresh air coming through the grill also going through the radiator...with the 1" spacers, some fresh air coming through the grill could then bypass the radiator going through the gap between the grill and radiator. It also means fresh air from outside the grill is pulled through the radiator at slow speed, as opposed to pulling hotter air from the engine bay around and through the grill.
    2) The Champion radiator fits perfect in terms of the mounting holes on the grill, but it leaves absolutely no clearance in terms of height between the front cross-member under the radiator, and the top of the radiator cap on the underside of the hood...The underside of the hood was sitting/rubbing the top of the radiator cap as it was, and the hood did not quite close the way you'd want it to. With the radiator just a bit further forward, there is just a smidge more room, and it feels like the hood closes properly, but it may still rub a bit.

    Downside to moving the radiator forward...the fan is an inch farther away from the radiator, but hopefully the shroud more the compensates for that and improves air flow through the radiator.
    The outlet hose on the radiator may be blocked by the battery tray support...This is gonna be close whether it will fit or not...but if not, I'll cut it out and weld it in differently...
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2020
  6. Apr 1, 2020
    45es

    45es Member 2019 Sponsor

    Naches, WA
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
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    Personally, I would be reluctant using steel screws or bolts to replace the plastic push pins. I understand your concerns but the potential wear to the softer aluminum and corrosion caused by the two dissimilar metals would keep me from doing it.
     
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  7. Apr 1, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
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    2,876
    good points...wonder if I could find higher quality, more substantial plastic fasteners - would like to go browse the hardware store and see what I could find....but....
     
  8. Apr 1, 2020
    45es

    45es Member 2019 Sponsor

    Naches, WA
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    Mar 31, 2007
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    I would think something is available. Look at places like Speedway or Summit. Maybe aftermarket electric fan manufacturers. Replacement push pins are available but I don't know if they are any heavier than what you have now.
     
  9. Apr 5, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
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    Went to bleed the new brake cylinder and line today...never did a close check of the brake system as it worked fine when I got it. Well, the right front has an issue - broken off bleeder...will try to cut a slot in it and see if I can remove with a screwdriver and replace it as is, otherwise its pull the entire hub to replace with the 'inboard' brake drums....the fluid is just some cleaner I sprayed on before I could see what was happening...
    [​IMG]

    Also, can't get any fluid to come out of the right rear - left rear is ok (I think), but might have an issue with that wheel cylinder as well...even more fun if I have to pull the hub to fix that....
     
  10. Apr 5, 2020
    Muzikp

    Muzikp Active Member 2020 Sponsor

    Sacramento Ca.
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    You have to pull the hub to replace the brake cylinders? I thought you would slide the drum off and pull the brake shoes and get to it that way :shrug:
     
  11. Apr 5, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
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    early jeeps the brake drum is behind the wheel hub....this is true of both the 9" cj brakes and the 11' wagner brakes on wagons and trucks....lots of fun...have an issue with the right rear cylinder as well (or something)...even bigger PITA getting the tapered hub off back there...
     
  12. Apr 5, 2020
    Muzikp

    Muzikp Active Member 2020 Sponsor

    Sacramento Ca.
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    Ugh! I have a hub puller if you need me to send it to you.
     
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  13. Apr 7, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
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    Ok -investigating the brake issues a bit more....So I wasn't able to salvage the RF wheel cylinder - no matter what I tried I couldn't get the broken off bleeder screw out, so that is a pretty straight forward fix - new passenger front wheel cylinder. Already pulled the hub and drum and removed it....ready for the new to go in when it gets here....
    But working on the passenger rear now...I pulled the line that goes into the cylinder and fluid flows fine out of the line when brake pedal is pushed....but when the line is attached to the cylinder, can't get any fluid out of the bleeder. I pulled the entire bleeder screw out and still nothing...So am I right in assuming I am going to need a new wheel cylinder there as well...Will also have to work on pulling the hub, but want to get parts ordered and on the way... Giving some thought to replacing all 4 wheel cylinders since I am already doing two....
     
  14. Apr 7, 2020
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Volvophilic

    Post Falls, ID
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    Yes. I was going to suggest this the other day, but you didn’t sound very enthused about doing two of them. :D
     
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  15. Apr 7, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
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    Was hoping I could salvage the RF by replacing the bleeder screw and hadn't yet confirmed I was getting fluid to the rear cylinders...There was some panic in my mind that I might have somehow criss-crossed part my line connections and and gotten 1 front with one rear etc...just wanted to go make sure it wasn't something I did wrong...but yea, once I am doing two, all four will get done....and the front hubs came out easy...these dualmatic (with the integrated levers) locking hubs are quite a bit less finagle-y than the warn ones on my cj. But I don't get why people have to trash spindle nuts - thus even when I have the correct spindle nut socket, it still won't fit on the trashed nut without some love...Now to see if I can find a hub puller
     
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  16. Apr 7, 2020
    melvinm

    melvinm Member

    Arvada Co. 80003
    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2012
    Messages:
    109
    James

    I have one if You would like to barrow it.

    Mel.

    Phone 303-420-8310
     
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  17. Apr 7, 2020
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs 2019 Sponsor

    At the foot of...
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    My dad's jeep was so gunked up in the wheel cylinders after sitting for a number of years that you could step on the brake pedal with the drums and shoes off and nothing would happen! I'm going to agree with itlksez...replace all 4.
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2020
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  18. Apr 7, 2020
    Dave Deyton

    Dave Deyton Member

    Fuquay-Varina, NC
    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2003
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    318
    I haven't had any luck with old wheel cylinders. Always seems if they have some age on them, just moving stuff around replacing brake shoes, then they start to leak. If I'm in there, now I just replace the wheel cylinders because I've had to go back in right away too many times. Just good insurance unless they are fairly new.


    Dave
     
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  19. Apr 7, 2020
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member 2020 Sponsor

    Denver, CO
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
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    4 new wheel cylinders are on their way...and I got the OTC hub puller (thanks to those that offered lending me theirs)....that was not in the budget, but tools are tools. And while I won't buy an electric miter saw, jeep tools are a different story. Plus, if I ever want to add a traction device to rear, rebuilt the rear axle, or do more with brakes (disc brakes?) then going to need the puller. But the puller does have to come out of the expense list somewhere, so new 16" rims and tires are definitely off, and hopefully I have a line on some used 15" wheels and tires on CL for way less...Better to have good brakes and useable wheels than awesome wheels and no brakes (I think...although I will probably weep just a bit tonight).
     
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  20. Apr 7, 2020
    Fireball

    Fireball Member 2020 Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    Adversity makes you stronger! ...or something.
     
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