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Engine cuts then coughs and hacks before running again

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by Greenshirt82, Jul 10, 2015.

  1. Jul 12, 2015
    1960willyscj5

    1960willyscj5 Well-Known Member

    Mesa, Arizona
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    Did you hook the fuel lines up to the pump backward?
    I ask, because that layout can be confusing. Especially if you have one of those pumps that also runs the windshield wiper motors.
     
  2. Jul 13, 2015
    Greenshirt82

    Greenshirt82 The Old Girl - '69 CJ5

    Southern Maryland
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    Electric wipers. The 5/16 lines are connected to the 5/16 ports; likewise for the 1/4 inch lines. To be clear, the tank has both a 1/4 and 5/16 metal tube connection at the float/sender. From there corresponding sized rubber hose goes to the engine compartment where it connects to metal tube again. These then connect to the fuel pump via short rubber hose. Two sizes of tube/hose and I ensured the were consistent, not mixing the sizes. A third connection on the pump, also 5/16, connects to the filter. The output from the filter goes to the carb.

    Today I'll try to ensure the pump is moving fuel into a quart jar.

    Regards,
    Tim
     
  3. Jul 13, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    This might not be the issue here, but it is possible to collapse rubber fuel hose when pulling a vacuum on it. I assume the 1/4" is the return so no big deal, but I have to wonder if the fuel pump is collapsing the 5/16" hose? Generally you should have as short a rubber hose as possible on the suction side of a fuel pump, with a metal line for most of the run.
     
  4. Jul 13, 2015
    Greenshirt82

    Greenshirt82 The Old Girl - '69 CJ5

    Southern Maryland
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    Just the opposite on this girl! About 3 feet of rubber hose from tank to engine, then hard lines across engine to fuel pump with short 2-3 inch rubber hoses connecting in and out of pump, to filter, then out of filter and then a hard line to the carb.

    1/4" is the fuel line, 5/16 is return line. Having written that down, it doesn't make sense...

    Regards,
    Tim
     
  5. Jul 13, 2015
    Alan28

    Alan28 Well-Known Member 2022 Sponsor

    Châtillon en...
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    I had many problems like this one and now all works well, execept when the fuel tank is too low.

    1 - I found with help of the forum that the accelarator pump on the carb was full of herb dust. Afer thouroughgly cleaning it was ok.

    2 - I had a spark plug broken, it was working but not always. I changed the spark plugs and it is perfect.

    There are many other possibilities, you can only check one by one.

    The most risky is to touch at the ignition system, because difficult to check. In fact my ignition system was good, only carburetor problem.

    2 days ago I have seen that the 2 screws of the carb were not very tighten. So again action.

    At first I had bad contacts in the wiring, some wire were spoiled, nude and when driving sometimes were touching the body and problem.


    Yhis is just to say that you must keep hope in the Future. It will work well one day.:p
     
  6. Jul 13, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    If 5/16 is the line from the pump to the filter, one would think 5/16 would be fuel to the pump and 1/4 the return. I wonder if the return line would simply enter the top of the tank and end?
     
  7. Jul 13, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    Looking at pictures on Walck's it appears the return does just end, which makes sense.
     
  8. Jul 13, 2015
    Greenshirt82

    Greenshirt82 The Old Girl - '69 CJ5

    Southern Maryland
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    Looking at it all it appears to me it may not be connected properly, however why would the 1/4" connector on the fuel pump be the intake, and the 5/16" be the return? Or should I just replace the 1/4" hose with 5/16" and ensure they are connected to the correct places?

    Time to carefully run through this all again tonight (post work).

    Regards,
    Tim
     
  9. Jul 13, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    It should be easy enough to determine which is the fuel supply from the tank. Take the cap off so you don't pressurized the tank, and carefully blow into the lines. You'll soon find which one blows directly through the fuel supply and which one into just vapor space. ;)
     
  10. Jul 13, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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  11. Jul 13, 2015
    Greenshirt82

    Greenshirt82 The Old Girl - '69 CJ5

    Southern Maryland
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    They do. And looking at it closer it appears all is connected properly.

    Fuel pump:Line on left is 5/16", middle is 1/4" and the elbow right is the output 1/4" to the filter.
    According to my FSM fig E-33, 5/16" is fuel inlet, 1/4" is vapor return and elbow on right is the fuel outlet.
    [​IMG]

    New fuel filter. 5/16" lines on both ends. I checked, it flows "up".
    [​IMG]

    Fuel lines in general. The two lines into the pump lead up and then back over the cylinder bank to the firewall. From their two rubber hoses continue across then down and aft to the fuel tank.

    From the fuel filter the 5/16" hose connects to a 5/16" metal pipe that goes to the carb.
    [​IMG]

    Fuel tank & sender. Tube (5/16") on left is fuel out and right one is 1/4" and vapor return.
    [​IMG]

    Regards,
    Tim
     
  12. Jul 13, 2015
    Greenshirt82

    Greenshirt82 The Old Girl - '69 CJ5

    Southern Maryland
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    Test done and fuel flow confirmed almost immediately (about 5 seconds gave me about 5 ounces).

    Where should I look next? Points?

    regards,
    Tim
     
  13. Jul 13, 2015
    tcfeet

    tcfeet Member

    east of west,...
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    I had a simular problem with my jeep. It would shut off at not any certain time, then catch back up.
    Turned out to be a loose wire on the ignition switch. Fixed that and been running ever since..
     
  14. Jul 13, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    Have you hooked it back up and it still won't start? Have you tried starting fluid again? If it will start with starting fluid it sounds like it still isn't getting gas. Is the needle valve stuck shut?
     
  15. Jul 13, 2015
    PeteL

    PeteL If it wasn't for physics, and law enforcement... 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Hills of NH
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    Did you confirm pressure? Quite different from flow. Both are important.
     
  16. Jul 13, 2015
    Greenshirt82

    Greenshirt82 The Old Girl - '69 CJ5

    Southern Maryland
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    I guess the carb is my next place to look. I did a spark check to ensure I'm getting spark in the plugs, and yes it sparks on turnover. I'll try the starter fluid again. How do I check the needle valve? The FSM isn't clear on that point, or I'm a dunce and just missing it.

    Regards,
    Tim
     
  17. Jul 13, 2015
    Greenshirt82

    Greenshirt82 The Old Girl - '69 CJ5

    Southern Maryland
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    I don't a means of testing fuel pressure.

    Regards,
    Tim
     
  18. Jul 13, 2015
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
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    Use a wrench or something to give a decent tap on the fuel inlet area of the carb. It just needs to be enough to jar the needle valve in case it is stuck. Obviously don't do something that would create a spark. I also wonder if the fuel pump isn't just bypassing back to the tank when there is any kind of resistance?

    Another idea might be to try pinching off the return line so any gas pumped would go straight to the carb in case it is bypassing. It can't hurt to do that just for a test to see if it will start.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2015
  19. Jul 13, 2015
    47v6

    47v6 junk wrecker! 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    USA
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    The vacuum gauge I own from Harbor Fright can do both. Its not too much money and works well to set idle screws correctly. You need a bright blue spark and not a yellow weak one.
     
  20. Jul 13, 2015
    Greenshirt82

    Greenshirt82 The Old Girl - '69 CJ5

    Southern Maryland
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    It was yellow. :cry:

    Regards,
    Tim
     
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