Frame restoration

OK, so I've spend a couple hours in front of the PC tonight. Searched several sights and can't find the answer to a question in step 3 below.

TO restore a frame:
1 - Use a degreaser and pressure washer to clean
2 - sandblast or wire wheel frame off
3 - Use an acid to convert rust. WHAT KIND OF ACID? zinc phosphate? Phosphoric? How to apply and use?
4 - Prime with an etching primmer
5 - topcoat with a good finish

I don't want to use POR 15 or another rust encapsulator product. No powder coat. Just a good primmer and paint. I need suggestions on products, application tricks, etc.

I want a long lasting paint on the frame for this build. I need to do some weld work and want to strip the frame to see what needs to be done to patch it. Once all welding is done, I want to be able to repair the paint eaisly.

Thanks.............

 

Acid- Phix is what I've heard, strips and converts the rust. Sandblasting is good.
POR 15, I have not a problem with. Even though my frame was as clean as could be, pressure washed it, wire wheel, pressure wash, touch up wire wheel, I used the POR just for added safety, then on top of it, POR Chassis Black (not encapsulating) Looks like factory new, cept the brush marks (my fault) Leveled out nicely though.

Why so against POR?

 

I used POR 15's Metal Ready and from what i remember, it's phosphoric acid and it's suppose to leave a residue of zinc phosphate as a rust inhibitor. I don't know if I'd trust it though to completely take care of the rust before applying the primer ( I used the rust encapsulator)....

a neighbor of mine suggested to me once to get my frame dipped in some solution at a place that does that process. He did that to his ford's frame and some body parts and it was clean and rust free. it could possibly save you from all the degreasing and rust removal...maybe someone here knows the process and how much it costs...

 

1. for sure.
2. sandblast (you will spend more in wire wheels and still be left w/ rust)
3. rust conversion unecessary for a sandblasted frame
4. self-etching primer unecessary for a sandblasted frame (blow it off, clean w/ paint prep, prime w/ primer/sealer)
5. topcoat w/ whatever. I prefer a hardened black implement paint (comes in flat, satin, or gloss, is extremely hard, and touch up paint is readily available in rattle can).:v6:

 

For a topcoat I've been having great luck with Rustoleum's Hammered finish paints...the finish is a bit rippled, but is very tough.
http://www.rustoleum.com/CBGProduct.asp?pid=29

 

If you sandblast I'd use an epoxy primer. Acid etch or dip not really needed if you use a quality primer. You can spray, brush or roll it on. Topcoat with your choice, implement enamel is tough, inexpensive and easily touched up. I've never tried POR, too pricey for me and living all my life in the rust belt I can tell you rust NEVER sleeps, no matter what you slather on it.

 

I dont' want to por 15 because I need to clean and prime the frame then do some welding work on it. I figured if I primed and welded, then I could eaisly prime again and then paint. No problems and eaisy to prime and repaint as needed later on in life.

And the acid after the sandblast is more for the inside of the frame. Shoud I spray the inside with a rust converter (product names please) then sandblast the outside fo the frame? If I do that and sandblast and prime, how will the next step of welding effect the protection of the previous steps?

I just want to make sure I do it right and only one time.

Down the road when I need to touch it up, just clean, prime and paint and good to go.

I'm not against por 15 or any of the other products, just not sure they are worth the money since I'm going to do the clean up then weld steps. I might por 15 it after it's all welded up but not sure.

 

I did all my weld work and wire wheel work in one weekend. Went through 12 dollars worth of HF wheels and it worked for me. Just some spots I couldn't reach with the wheel, oh well.
Have it sand blasted. Then sprayed with a weld through primer (IIRC there is a thing)

 

sand blast, etch prime and paint with a normal paint. will look a million bucks

 

I've use rustoleums hammered finish for years. Excellent product. kinda wierd that only place I can find it is Walmart.

 

Is the Rustoleum Hammered finsh better than the professional paints? THe shop next to mine is an autobody shop that does a lot of restorative work. I had expected to pick up some good quality paint from them.

And if I use an etching primmer, do I still need to use phoshoric acid on the outside of the frame? I was going to use it inside the frame (Or por 15 on the inside) but use the etching primmer and paint only on the outside.

Thanks for all the help.

 

I used the self-etching primmer on a dirt-track race car frame and all I did was wipe it down, then prime it. Pretty nasty stuff. Make sure you are covered and wear a good mask. As it turned out, I put the paint on with too much reducer, to much hardener and too much air pressure with a HVLP setup. The end result was the paint was too brittle. After a few seasons, the paint was very pitted but the primer underneath held up great.

Of course, all the bent pieces I replaced thought time didn't get the good primer and you could tell the difference because when they pitted, it rusted underneath.

I may use the etching primer again when I get around to doing my frame.