Grinding Going into Third

My jeep was working perfectly. About two months ago, ventured about 40 miles from the house (furthest I've ever dared), driving on jeep trails and mountain roads. Had a blast too, with the whole family.

About half-way up the mountain, noticed some resistance when trying to shift OUT of third. On the way down the mountain, I had a very difficult time getting it out of third. Once I got it out, it wouldn't go into ANY gear at all. No detents, no grinding, nothing. We coasted about a mile down a very bumpy road, and then the gears started working again.

Since then, I've driven it around the neighborhood a bit. Everything is normal except it "slightly" grinds going into third. If I go in and out of third, then right back in it does not grind. I think I have gears or something sliding someplace when they are not supposed to.

I found this on a website: "I've had several folks that have rebuilt their T-90s, only to still have the same problem with gears grinding during the 2nd and 3rd up-shift. After going back and replacing the crankshaft pilot bushing, the problem went away."
http://www.willystech.com/wt/T90RebuildGuide/T90rebuild.htm

I can't find anything similar by searching on this website.

Anyhow. What do you think? You fellas have never let me down before.

Blue Blue Goose

 

My T-86 doesn't always shift well from 2nd to 3rd, however it does fine on 3rd to 2nd thou. I figured that the sncyros are going out, because I got a LOT of brass when I changed the oil last week.

 

:iagree:

 

Alrighty. Took the lid off the transmission. Attached are some of the obvious things even I could see.

Now, to keep things simple I wouldn't mind staying w/ the same transmission. Where do I go from here?

I've read as much as I could stand on the forum about rebuilding an all. Sounds like many folks go to a different tranny. I wouldn't mind keeping the T86.

I'd like to get the transmission out of there for closer inspection, maybe a little TLC. What is the easiest way for a wannabe to get that done? Do I have to remove the engine, or is there a better/easier way?

Thanks for looking.

Blue

 

It's not bad to pull. Disconnect rear drive shaft, remove crossmember, remove transfercase (optional, can pull as one unit), unbolt tranny from bellhousing.

An ATV jack, floor jack with cradle, or tranny jack, or straps hanging from above will simplify the manhandling.

You can get a T86 rebuild kit from Herm the OD guy. The new drive gear (input shaft) and cluster gear will be very costly unless you can find good used parts for a reasonable price.

I went with T90 internals in mine because of price/parts availability. I think my old input shaft is in good shape (from my T86). I could pass it along for a very reasonable price.

 

MOP, I may take you up on your old parts. Let me get further along though before I commit.

Looking rear to front, I've got a warn overdrive unit, then the transfer case, then the transmission. If I undo the bolts from the tranny to the engine/flywheel/(insert proper terminology), then put a jack under the crossmember and unbolt it from the frame, I can carefully move then entire unit aft and down correct?

Is it a ton easier to remove the pieces one at a time, or what?

Also, what pitfalls should I watch out for.

Insert "I learned about my jeep from..." story here.

Thanks again.

Blue

 

No problem. I don't have a cluster gear (mine was trashed), and that is the most $$$$ part if you can' find a good used one.

You have the removal down for the most part. I think it would be best to remove your OD case and (planetary?) gear first. That nut is torqued pretty good, and is prob easier to bust loose with the jeep in gear.

 

Yeah, I've done the one-at-a-time with a scissors jack and muscle. A floor jack or transmission jack would be easier though. More clearance helps too, though again I've done it with the Jeep sitting on the ground. The usual cautions (use strong jack stands, no cinder blocks or jacks - I like to keep cut-off wooden beam ends around to put the wheels or jack stands on if I need a little more height).

You should be able to remove the nut on the shop floor if you take the shift top off and put the transmission in two gears at once.

There was a free T-86 in MD which I posted in the Classifieds several days ago. It's from a 232 J-truck, but you could probably use everything but the input shaft.

 

Blue Goose: Keep us posted on this...gotta do this myself soon!

 

Glenn and all. All those complex terms sound Arabic to me. Give me some skinned nuckles and a couple of weeks and I will be caught up with the lingo.

Glenn, are you saying that in the first picture labeled 'edited t86' that the yellow box area looks normal? I thought it looks like that metal is broken/bent out of shape.

I guess no matter, it's coming apart anyhow. I'm off for nine days now, so hopefully we can get it all taken apart, and make some decisions of where to go from here.

I will post my progress, along with many questions I'm sure.

Blue

 

X3 on the motorcycle jack. I took the trans and transfer case out of my TJ and put them back in by myself. I lined up the whole thing and pulled the Jeep to it using a come along. Worked great.

Paul

 

Glenn, I think you are right. I didn't notice it until I had taken the pictures, and the reason is because it looks alright. It is an illusion. I see what you meant now.

Thank goodness for people more knowledgable than I.

 

Alright. It's only been nine months. It got too cold to work outside, and then too hot, and I'm too lazy, but I got the whole thing (tranny, transfer case, and od) on the bench.

I got what I believe to be the OD off, but and the bolts from the tranny and transfer case off and separated. There is a 'Planetary????" gear inside the transfer case that wont fit thru the hole. I have to remove it right? So there are to spring-like clips in there. Got the big one out, damaged one in the middle getting it out. Now what?

Thanks,

Blue

 

Ah, just found this:

From Novak site:

If the Model 18 is equipped with Warn overdrive, it must be removed before the transfer case can be removed from the transmission. To accomplish this, disengage the Warn overdrive. Remove the shift linkage from the O/D. Remove the five bolts that hold the O/D to the transfer case. The four bolts on the back cover of the O/D do not require removal. The O/D housing can now be pulled straight back for removal. If necessary, the housing can be tapped back (while pulling on by hand) with a plastic faced hammer or block of wood. Be careful, the housing is aluminum and is easily damaged. Do not attempt to pry the overdrive off. Note that bearing seat constriction may prevent easy removal. In this case, remove the rear cap of the overdrive. Attach a slide hammer to the six-spline tube and tap it rearward. With the unit now separated, continue as indicated.

With the housing removed, the hub assembly is now accessible. Use a light to look in the hole in the center of the hub assembly. You should see a square shaped flat wire lock ring in a groove. A thin pair of long nose pliers can be used to squeeze the ends of the lockring together for removal. The lockplate (or washer, in common parlance) that was retained by the lockring can now be removed. With these removed, use a regular 1/2" drive socket extension to remove the special hub retaining nut. This has a regular right hand (counter-clockwise to loosen) thread. When the hub nut threads disengage, the hub can be removed from the output shaft.

The transfer case can now be separated by removal of the five retaining bolts. One is on the front side near the front driveshaft yoke.