Ol Fogie
74 cj5 304, 1943 gpw, in moth balls,
Ah, yes, Thankyou, I was worried I had a defective gear case.Sorry I am so late, but yes, a hole to get a drift in to get the snap ring out.
Saginaw Power Steering (pics) Please Add Yours!
- Thread starter Mcruff
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- power steering saginaw
Did the radiator clear the steering gear without any modification ?Photo of my setup showing most of the components. I used the Herm kit with the Ford reverse PS gear. I do like that it stays inside the engine compartment. I arranged the PS gear where I had the best clearance on the fuel pump. I was able to remove and install the fuel pump recently without removing PS Gear.
The mount from Herm clamps to the frame using only one bolt in the center. I drilled two more holes and used two 1/2" bolts.
Dana 30 front with new draglink and Tierod. The draglink is flipped to the top but I left the tierod on bottom of the steering knuckle.
Never could have done this without ECJ5 and all of your help. Thanks
No. I had to clearance the bottom of the radiator with a BFH.
Ol Fogie
74 cj5 304, 1943 gpw, in moth balls,
BFH
Thanks.
Play Dead
New Member
Most of the parts I used came from AA. Gear box from a J10 truck. Column is a GM clone. I hate chrome but it was scratched and got it for half price.
Only have 2 rotations of the wheel from stop to stop. It steers easily and smooth even without hydraulics connected. No bump steer. I don’t like the angle from pitman arm to passenger knuckle. If I were to do it again I would do the tie rod flip, and use a shorter drop pitman arm to get the hydraulic connections inside the grill and correct the geometry. For now it works better than the Ross. I’ll be looking for a narrow 30 axle and redo the box location and pitman arm down the road. Column is captured at the floorboard/firewall with a steel plate and a muffler clamp. Captured at the dash with 2”x3” angle iron and a muffler clamp. From the angle iron inside dash I attached 1 1/2” x 3/16” flat to the firewall and another to the hood hinge bolt under cowl. View media item 11542View media item 11541View media item 11539View media item 11538View media item 11536View media item 11540View media item 11538
Only have 2 rotations of the wheel from stop to stop. It steers easily and smooth even without hydraulics connected. No bump steer. I don’t like the angle from pitman arm to passenger knuckle. If I were to do it again I would do the tie rod flip, and use a shorter drop pitman arm to get the hydraulic connections inside the grill and correct the geometry. For now it works better than the Ross. I’ll be looking for a narrow 30 axle and redo the box location and pitman arm down the road. Column is captured at the floorboard/firewall with a steel plate and a muffler clamp. Captured at the dash with 2”x3” angle iron and a muffler clamp. From the angle iron inside dash I attached 1 1/2” x 3/16” flat to the firewall and another to the hood hinge bolt under cowl. View media item 11542View media item 11541View media item 11539View media item 11538View media item 11536View media item 11540View media item 11538
Looks good! Might keep an eye out for a shorter pitman arm with a drop and your floorboard plate could use a sandwich plate on the underside of the tub.
Play Dead
New Member
I picked a wrangler pitman arm. Between flipping the tie rods and the 2” drop in the arm it should be really close to perfect. I also think the shorter arm will slow the steering down. View media item 11543Great idea on the sandwich!
I'll just leave this here.
https://forums.4wdmechanix.com/topic/222-installing-a-pitman-arm-correctly/
https://forums.4wdmechanix.com/topic/222-installing-a-pitman-arm-correctly/
If at first you don't succeed...
Weld on another... Or drill a thousand 1/2" holes by hand in 1/2"plate. step out the frame holes for bushings and hope they line up when finished.
(I am not cutting that old bracket off any time soon)
Weld on another... Or drill a thousand 1/2" holes by hand in 1/2"plate. step out the frame holes for bushings and hope they line up when finished.
(I am not cutting that old bracket off any time soon)
Last edited:
Danefraz
Fourth hobby: box builder. Don't ask me to think.
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Hole saw mighta worked better,,, less resistance, and high flow
to the ground….
have me several BFH kenetic persuaders
garage gnome
Rust polisher
My saginaw swap with a Scout steering box.
Nate, I like that idea. How many turns do you get with that box?
Ol Fogie
74 cj5 304, 1943 gpw, in moth balls,
x2,
garage gnome
Rust polisher
3.5 turns with that box.
colojeepguy
Colorado Springs
The problem with that swap is finding one!
I searched for a long time to find the one in my son's Willys pickup.
ScottInAZ
fixer of broken things
got my Sag box mounted this morning. Went with a modified YJ frame bracket, and a 1980's GM "A" or "G" body box.
The YJ bracket requires some pretty severe modifications. There is a piece on it that is supposed to butt against the bottom of the frame rail. This needs to come completely off. This essentially turns it into a cast iron copy of the AA bracket, BUT, I got mine for under $20... so I call that a win. Went for an under crossmember installation, so had to add a section onto the frame boxing plate to pick up the two lower gearbox bolts (I still need to make and install the gussets to the frame for this section.... dont crucify me for that yet....) with a Late model CJ pitman arm on the box, the drag link ends up nearly parallel with the tie rod. I have one point of interference, but that was likely there with the Ross steering as well... the passengers side drag link end (the actual ball joint section) hits the spring. Since this point didnt move, that was an issue before hand.... Ill address that with some 1" longer shackles....
Power steering hoses and all are still not ordered, but will be done with O-ring to -6AN adapters so that I can custom make the hoses to fit. I have plenty of room for them, and being a Ford engined Jeep, a little creativity is in order....
I am still waiting on one more piece of DD stock to hook up to the aftermarket GM style column. I have it all mounted, but the piece of stock I got was just 18"... not long enough, and Ill need another universal joint and an eyeball support in there to clear exhaust.
I have full pics in my build thread, but here are a few for those that are interested....
Initial test fit for the YJ plate. I had already removed part of the "shelf". Right now its just sitting on a support for a crude lineup.
boxing plate is made, the lower extension is welded to it, and the lower gearbox bolts are holding it in place. Its clamped to the frame for final fitment before I burned it in. I went a bit lower than my original marks, for a bit more under crossmember clearance. My drag link is about an inch and a half forward of the tie rod, and is nearly paralell with it (slightly above, less than half a diameter of the tubing).
this is the lower extension piece. It will get a couple/three gussets to attach it to the frame as well. I dont have them installed at the moment. Yes, this plate was made out of several smaller pieces. Its still 1/4" and plenty strong. I didnt fully grind down this side, no real reason to at the moment.
the factory Ross drag link fits, but is a bit short for my tastes. Too much exposed thread. It will work for getting a measurement for a new one, and also for yard steering use until that arrives. Its about as close to the spring as the tie rod is, so about a fingers width above the spring.
u joint on the shaft has plenty of clearance under the crossmember, as does the DD stock. This was my original goal, to not have to cut the crossmember.
I have about a fingers width clearance here as well. once I get the new piece of DD stock, and can connect this to the column, ill be in good shape. Exhaust clearance may be a bit tight, but nothing a 5# sledge and a socket cant cure.... strategic denting of the headers is very much allowed....
since my Ross column was pretty trashed (outer sleeve was swiss cheese...) I went with a Chinesium GM style aftermarket column. For $150, it wasnt worth trying to mess with fixing the old one.... the wiring hookups and internal switches make it worth it no matter what....
The YJ bracket requires some pretty severe modifications. There is a piece on it that is supposed to butt against the bottom of the frame rail. This needs to come completely off. This essentially turns it into a cast iron copy of the AA bracket, BUT, I got mine for under $20... so I call that a win. Went for an under crossmember installation, so had to add a section onto the frame boxing plate to pick up the two lower gearbox bolts (I still need to make and install the gussets to the frame for this section.... dont crucify me for that yet....) with a Late model CJ pitman arm on the box, the drag link ends up nearly parallel with the tie rod. I have one point of interference, but that was likely there with the Ross steering as well... the passengers side drag link end (the actual ball joint section) hits the spring. Since this point didnt move, that was an issue before hand.... Ill address that with some 1" longer shackles....
Power steering hoses and all are still not ordered, but will be done with O-ring to -6AN adapters so that I can custom make the hoses to fit. I have plenty of room for them, and being a Ford engined Jeep, a little creativity is in order....
I am still waiting on one more piece of DD stock to hook up to the aftermarket GM style column. I have it all mounted, but the piece of stock I got was just 18"... not long enough, and Ill need another universal joint and an eyeball support in there to clear exhaust.
I have full pics in my build thread, but here are a few for those that are interested....
Initial test fit for the YJ plate. I had already removed part of the "shelf". Right now its just sitting on a support for a crude lineup.
boxing plate is made, the lower extension is welded to it, and the lower gearbox bolts are holding it in place. Its clamped to the frame for final fitment before I burned it in. I went a bit lower than my original marks, for a bit more under crossmember clearance. My drag link is about an inch and a half forward of the tie rod, and is nearly paralell with it (slightly above, less than half a diameter of the tubing).
this is the lower extension piece. It will get a couple/three gussets to attach it to the frame as well. I dont have them installed at the moment. Yes, this plate was made out of several smaller pieces. Its still 1/4" and plenty strong. I didnt fully grind down this side, no real reason to at the moment.
the factory Ross drag link fits, but is a bit short for my tastes. Too much exposed thread. It will work for getting a measurement for a new one, and also for yard steering use until that arrives. Its about as close to the spring as the tie rod is, so about a fingers width above the spring.
u joint on the shaft has plenty of clearance under the crossmember, as does the DD stock. This was my original goal, to not have to cut the crossmember.
I have about a fingers width clearance here as well. once I get the new piece of DD stock, and can connect this to the column, ill be in good shape. Exhaust clearance may be a bit tight, but nothing a 5# sledge and a socket cant cure.... strategic denting of the headers is very much allowed....
since my Ross column was pretty trashed (outer sleeve was swiss cheese...) I went with a Chinesium GM style aftermarket column. For $150, it wasnt worth trying to mess with fixing the old one.... the wiring hookups and internal switches make it worth it no matter what....
ScottInAZ
fixer of broken things
add on for the steering shaft. DD stock came yesterday, so after work I whipped up the shaft. I still need to drill the hole for the eyeball support, but thats a 3 minute job.
For those on the fence about this job, dont be. I was apprehensive about pulling the Ross box out, and redoing everything. It amounted to about a days worth of work with all the stuff here. Not nearly as bad as I had anticipated. This is a VERY well documented swap, parts are readily available, and what you get in the end is MUCH better than what you started with.
the setup actually clears everything VERY well. Very happy with how it all turned out.
For those on the fence about this job, dont be. I was apprehensive about pulling the Ross box out, and redoing everything. It amounted to about a days worth of work with all the stuff here. Not nearly as bad as I had anticipated. This is a VERY well documented swap, parts are readily available, and what you get in the end is MUCH better than what you started with.
the setup actually clears everything VERY well. Very happy with how it all turned out.
duffer
Rodent Power, Bozeman, Montana
A few photos of the last iteration of the C3 Saginaw box installation in my 3B. I moved the box as far forward as possible for this time around.
You still have to poke a hole in the grill for the steering shaft in this arrangement.
A Tuffstuff Performance Gen II block mounted PS pump is utilized with the GM control valve, with the Howard clocking. A quart remote reservoir with an expansion tank, quart hydraulic filter, 2" diameter PSC axle mounted assist cylinder, and a Flex-A-Lite cooler complete the system.
The pressure lines are Parker hose with Fragola steel JIC fittings.
You still have to poke a hole in the grill for the steering shaft in this arrangement.
A Tuffstuff Performance Gen II block mounted PS pump is utilized with the GM control valve, with the Howard clocking. A quart remote reservoir with an expansion tank, quart hydraulic filter, 2" diameter PSC axle mounted assist cylinder, and a Flex-A-Lite cooler complete the system.
The pressure lines are Parker hose with Fragola steel JIC fittings.
I dont know about everyone else but I'm ready to see some action pictures of this Jeep!!A few photos of the last iteration of the C3 Saginaw box installation in my 3B. I moved the box as far forward as possible for this time around.
You still have to poke a hole in the grill for the steering shaft in this arrangement.
A Tuffstuff Performance Gen II block mounted PS pump is utilized with the GM control valve, with the Howard clocking. A quart remote reservoir with an expansion tank, quart hydraulic filter, 2" diameter PSC axle mounted assist cylinder, and a Flex-A-Lite cooler complete the system.
The pressure lines are Parker hose with Fragola steel JIC fittings.