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Fino's 1970 Cj5 Build Thread

Thanks for the offer Chuck - not sure what is formal definition of cage. But currently its more than just a behind the seats hoop roll-bar. It has a front windshield hoop as well - which I like - don't trust the windshield to support the vehicle in a roll-over. All is mounted to body though - no frame tie-ins. My only complaint is that it has the sort of FJ40 rear right angle support instead of the more jeep style diagonal rear support (aesthetic). No family/rear seat cage or hoop - don't have either so not needed :)

Somehow I have almost no pics of it anywhere - must leave the top on too much - an no before and after the recent clean-up. This is the only pic I got - how it used to look. Still had all the electrical tape covering it with some foam padding under the tape and a bunch of wires that went to speakers, dome light, cb etc. The rear fender mounts had some decent backing plates, but the front were literally held on with washers, and not high grade one (actually have a pic of that) All that's been removed, stripped and new black paint and new backing plates made.



how the front hoop was held on when I got it - will have to get pics of the new backing plates.

 
For some reason I didn't think you had that front hoop. As long as the plates have been worked right (shear issues normally) you should be good. There is always the 'aesthetics', and I don't like many folks 'jungle gym' looks.
 
Just an update...Took more hassle than expected but now running Pertronix with a Pertronix FT coil. Had some issues getting what should have been a simple install working correctly...or maybe I just didn't know what to expect. I did have to shim my distributor, but I also had a lot of trouble getting the magnet ring to stay within spec of the module. It was like the ring itself was slightly warped (not flat). I ended up spacing the ring differently on each side of the rotor, but that keeps it within spec. As part of the pertronix purchase from a ECJ5 member, I got an old Delco distributor as well, which had a much nicer gear than mine, so I put that on as well. I kind of combined the best parts of the two distributors to hopefully make one that is pretty good. The remaining parts went back together with good points that can be carried as a spare/back-up. Also installed a Pertronix Flamethrower coil and created a jumper wire with quick blade connectors to bypass the external resistor. Left the resistor in place and can easily disconnect the jumper if I need to go back to the old coil. So now have a complete spare set-up from coil through distributor and cap.

But even after all that, I had some trouble with it running smoothly - had a bit of a misfire. Two causes...1) I had to retune the carb a bit for idle speed and mix. Was getting a bit of a lean misfire. 2) New plug wires did not seem to insulate properly on the new coil. Was getting some small arcing at the coil to the high V wire to the distributor. Could not seem to get that connection properly insulated. After looking around in the dark some more also found some similar minor arcing at the #5 plug. So put the old wires back on and it was fine. The new wires are Accell brand suppression wires - seem nicer than what I was using (some generic brand of suppression wires) but the rubber insulator at the connections doesn't seem to do its job as well.

Anyway - maybe give it a bit of a run this weekend in the mountains before winter fully arrives. I am not so much looking for huge noticeable power or performance gains, but will hopefully be nice to not have to adjust and change points every so often. I also have a habit of burning points by leaving the ignition on when I accidently choke it down off road and then get distracted. Plus, the consistency of the timing is WAY better (at least on the #1 plug). It used to be that Whenever I set timing it was really +/-3 degrees (if not more). A lot of that was the endplay in the distributor and wear on the distributor gear, and I cut that in half by shimming it...but now it just holds exactly.

Next project is the rear gas tank...
 
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Making some progress on the rear tank install. Currently, I have the tank and skid installed and now need to put in the fuel lines going forward and the filler neck and hose along with drilling the body to mount the neck. But its been a bit of work just to get this far so thought I'd celebrate the progress and post some details...

Started with a junkyard tank with all brackets and old hoses etc. Pulled from a 71 I believe - maybe a 72. I was specifically looking for the early 70s vintage although that might have been a mistake. I think the brackets for the tank are a real hassle to mount, and then mounting the tank separate from the skid adds some complication as well. Would probably recommend to someone to get a 76 and later tank that mounts to the skid then mount all of it at once...but don't know that for sure. Anyway, here are the starter pics....



Everything looked great until I started cleaning the tank....


Might have been salvageable...but I decided to order a new tank - was good to have all the brackets/skid as well as the filler neck. (The tank will be posted in classified if anyone thinks its worth fixing...)

Here is the new tank - also got a new sending unit (with return line).

 
So...then the fun began. Had to cut out the diagonal braces that go to the old pintle hitch.








I also had to cut out the tail pipe - a repleacement exhaust was put in last year but we didn't leave quite enough room. The muffler is far enough forward that its not a problem but a new tail pipe will be needed.

Then I had to drill into the top of the frame for the mounting brackets that go at the rear of the frame. There was not much room - had to increase my tool collection to get a very low profile extension for my drill to fit in the 4" space.
Here are the holes and then with the painted brackets installed.
Its the one right under the red wire - looks roomy but its barely 4 inches


with the spiffed up brackets (this was later on but shows how it goes on the frame)


When mocking up with new tank - you can see the very bottom of the bracket (still rusty) under the corner of the tank (photo taken from underneath). Its a tight fit in that corner.


This also brings up the sort of web bracing or one sided dovetail at the end of the frame where it connects with the rear crossmember - its just inside of the shackle hanger. This little frame extender required cutting and grinding the rear corners of the new tank to allow them to fit up through the frame.
 
The front mount is pretty easy - drill 2 holes in the cross-member that is right behind the rear axle. Sorry no pics as it was straightforward.

Then on to paint. I actually painted a bit early and still had some test fitting to do with the skid plate, but had some ideal weather here in Colo and was expecting the winter weather to come at some point....


When test fitting the skid plate - found the Warrior shackle bolts were very long and could hit the skid if flex enough (a little unlikely, but easy enough to replace). Pic with nuts unscrewed to the end of the bolt. Assume that Warrior uses the same bolts for a variety of jeep applications and these long bolts are bit much for 1.75 inches, but also would work for the later 2 inch wide springs (or whatever they are).


With that all taken care of - then it was time to mock up the skid plate. Had to remove my aftermarket bumper/tire carrier to pre-drill the skid mounting holes along the rear cross-member. Pretty basic except these cannot be bolts with nuts on the back side. There is no way to access the inside of the rear cross-member once the tank is mounted. So again off to the hardware store in search of unique stuff. Not sure how well it will work but found some large(ish) self-tapping metal screws. Not nearly as burly as the mounting hardware that was on it in the junkyard - but couldn't find anything close. If I ever find something, its a pretty easy replacement. Skid plate front mount is two more holes in the front cross-member.

Almost there - had to clean up the brace cuts and paint the exposed metal. Was about to start mounting the tank and realized my plan for the fuel lines wasn't going to work. The space is so tight, the only option I could come up with (and saw some examples from various other build threads) was to run the fuel lines through the front cross member. I used one of the old drawbar brace holes and added a second one next to it.

AFter alll that, the mounting went pretty well with a second set of hands to help get some bolts aligned and nuts started while I held things in place. All the sending unit lines and electrical are routed out of the area and everything is ready to move on to the next two steps: 1) bend hard line going forward to the pump (well eventually to a switch that will select between underseat and rear tank (and switch return line and gauge sending line). 2) get the filler hose and filler neck figured out and mounted.

Some bad pics as it was late and dark...but this was good to see...




 
James - be sure to check that the rear diff isn't going to smash into the tank on full compression... that is why I have a tank just like that with a split right up the middle on the front side. Mine happened when I went to the Holbrooks as they flex more than the BDS springs that were on it.

And why I build my own tanks now ;)
 
Nice job on the tank. as Chuck states, watch for differential hitting the tank. I would like to see how you're going to connect up the tank to the filler neck. Great work!
 
yes work to do, nice welding work.
About the rear fuel tank, one idea : separate fuel alimentation and fuel sending unit. This is my dream, because I am fed up with my fuel gauge.
My idea is to make a hole in the tank and put a sender for boat fuel tank, independant, good quality. This will be connected on the dash to a good gauge and the fuel level will be true.
 
Warloch said:
James - be sure to check that the rear diff isn't going to smash into the tank on full compression... that is why I have a tank just like that with a split right up the middle on the front side. Mine happened when I went to the Holbrooks as they flex more than the BDS springs that were on it.

And why I build my own tanks now ;)
Click to expand...

Yes - I do have a little concern of that. Guess time and use will tell. I do have a couple inches between the front of the tank and the skid plate, so I could modify the skid a bit and bend it to make a bit more room - and as long as it doesn't damage the diff cover, some damage to the skid is not big issue as long as it doesn't get pushed all the way into the tank. If I ever get around to replacing the leaf springs with something more flexy, then could definitely be a problem.
 
47v6 said:
Nice job on the tank. as Chuck states, watch for differential hitting the tank. I would like to see how you're going to connect up the tank to the filler neck. Great work!
Click to expand...

So would I....that is the next project and I am having quite the internal debate over trying to put the filler neck where it would have been on a stock 1971 - which is right where my passenger side reverse light is. Could also try to squeeze the filler neck and cap above the reverse light, but space is tight up under the rear wheel well. So my current idea is to go out the passenger rear quarter on the side kind of where the OEM spare tire would mount. Much less 'aesthetic' to me but might be the most viable/easy solution.

Open to suggestions and those with experience...
 
I am having a similar dilemma, but am less far ahead than you. Keep us posted, I am very interested!
 
Get the line and filler - let it tell you where to put it if possible. I have to use custom line on my setups and that stuff is EXPENSIVE compared to just getting stock fuel line from neck to filler.
 
update on fuel tank - got the filler location taken care of.








Wow those photos came out small...will work on that soon

I ended up putting the filler on the passenger side rear quarter for reasons of ease and fitment. I would have preferred to squeeze it above the reverse lights on the rear, but just seemed to tight for me to get to fit without a lot of hassle and probably would have screwed it up. Digging around under the rear fender, it looks like there has been some repair work already done in the area I assume due to the old side-mount tire hanger causing some damage. I removed the rusted out and mostly dangling horizontal channel support that reinforced the bottom two mount holes (filled at some point by PO). The vertical panel support is still very solid so I left that, but as you can see in the pics, the upper mount hole is starting to reappear as the filler is cracking out. The good news was all this old damage and repair made it a little less gut-wrenching to cut a big hole into the body!

Removing the channel support gave me a lot more room to fit the filler neck so I didn't have to be exactly precise in my mounting. I debated drilling a 2 1/8" hole that would just fit the 1971 metal filler neck and leaving it at that. But I ended up drilling a 2 3/4" hole and then used a rubber 'grommet' to make things look a bit more finished. Not certain that was the best idea - it looks good now but guessing the rubber will dry and crack pretty quickly and then I might be regretting that decision.

As for the filler hose, I managed to buy 2ft of fuel rated hose with a 45 degree bend. I cut about 8" off one end used the big piece to connect to the filler neck. The 45 bend brings the hose down to the tank, where I used an exhaust pipe elbow and the short 8" cut-off to connect to the tank. Requires some extra hose clamps, but I think it will work and I didn't have to break the bank to make work.
 
FWIW - I put mine on the side as well. I found issues with the back and lights, Tire carrier, Jacks, people...
 
The later style filler has a recessed housing, if you'd rather have that.

RearCorners.jpg


This is Mike Boyink's old Jeep, from his page.

The recessed housing makes it less likely you'll scrape the filler neck on rocks, trees, etc.

Here's my CJ-6 when I got it -

RrPSCorner.jpg


You can see that the back-up light is positioned higher than on your Jeep, which leaves room for the filler neck. That intermediate filler neck is unobtainium today, and I expect it would be easy to sell if you wanted to.

NB the exhaust exits on the side opposite the filler.
 
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Cheers Tim - given that I was originally planning on squeezing the filler on the rear like an intermediate, I went with that style round filler neck that fits with the lights. I was going to try and put the filler where the intermediate reverse light is which would be above my back-up light, but space up under the fenderwell was tight. After deciding not to do that, and mounting on the side of the quarter, I can see the benefits of using the later style recessed square filler like on Boyink (whose page i read many times working on this project - thanks). I guess its just aesthetic preference - I wanted to use the round filler as it was more age appropriate in my mind - but that is kind of out the window now. Although I wheel the jeep quite a bit, I am not too concerned about catching the filler cap, but will think about going with the later recessed style - as you say I can probably offset the cost by selling the intermediate neck.

Interesting to note on your cj6 that the mounts for the filler neck are under the filler - that was something I didn't notice or get a picture when I pulled the parts from the junkyard, and ended up mounting mine 'upside' down with mounting bolts on top. No big deal...but it would allow for the filler neck to be slightly bent and angle downward for easier filling.

Still have to finishing routing fuel lines to the front. I have the lines up to the firewall, now have to bend them up and over the back of the engine.
 
IM looking to do this to my 66 CJ, what kind of gas tank and parts did you use FINO? fuel lines, tank (dimensions if possible) sender unit, etc?
 
Sorry shaun - just saw your note as I was logging into my thread to say THE JEEP IS RUNNING ON THE REAR TANK! Woot Woot!

I used Walcks tank for a 70-75 CJ5/6 http://walcks4wd.com/fuel-tank-cj5-cj6-rear-mount-1.html
I also ordered a new sending unit from them (I like that they have a brass float) and the one I bought from them for my underseat tank has worked well so far.

If I were to do it over again, I would probably have gone with a 76 and later tank and skid - probably easier to install as the tank and skid go together first before mounting them as a unit. Getting the tank mounted on mine was the tough part - then the skid mounts separately which was pretty easy. I originally pulled a 71 junkyard tank that looked very promising, but turned out it needed more refurbishing than I was comfortable doing so I had to order the tank from Walcks. Getting the mounting brackets and skid for the 70-75 is the hard part (have to find them salvage) but it was all there at the JY. But once I had to buy the new tank, then I was kind of stuck as I had all the 70-75 brackets so that is the way I went. I also got the filler neck at the JY.

As you can find from a lot of the previous threads on the forum...you may have to remove (unbolt if its not too rusted) the draw bar braces (I did this a couple years ago when I installed a custom rear bumper/tire carrier). They are hard to find...but there are draw bar braces that go outside of the frame rails so you can keep the bar. You also have to cut out the diagonal 'frame' braces that I believe were heritage from the pintle hitch option. I cut mine out pretty roughly with a 4.5 inch grinder with cut-off disk and then cleaned it up with some die grinder and cut-off disk. Oh, and depending on how your exhaust is routed, then the back of that may need to be cut-out as well.

The hardest part for me was drilling some of the holes needed in the rear frame to mount the tank brackets - this is what I think you can avoid if you go with a 76 and later tank. Without the body off, there was not much room and I had to invest in some special low clearance tools and bits. I had to barely modify the rear corners of the tank (trim the flat seem and make the corner round) so it would more easily fit up inside the frame rails. Again, if the body were off and the tank was coming down from the top, not necessary, but since I had to squeeze up from the bottom with the longer hose extensions, I needed an inch more clearance.

Finally, I just spent the last couple weeks figuring out my fuel lines. I custom rigged my filler hose from some generic fuel hose from FLAPS and an elbow exhaust connector. You can buy replacement filler hoses, and I probably should have put my filler in the proper spot to use one, but with my reverse lights it wasn't so easy.

I also went with hard fuel lines that I bent and probably over did it, but I put good flare nut connections to hose nipples on each end as I preferred that to flaring the end of the line for the short hose connections. Eventually I want to run a dual tank set-up, and I am looking into a 6port switching valve - but its time to drive it for a bit and take a brake from the cold garage nights.

THink its college football and beer time....Rear tank running on jeep! Whoop Whoop!
 
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Yes it is! MSU is my team. Thanks for the information as well. It will help me in the long run. I will be cutting the dia. frame because i will not be using it for towing anyway. You have a great looking jeep. I'll have to update my pictures soon. Still doing body work and will be taking the body off for sandblasting so the tank will go in easy if I get a 76' or later.
 
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