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Yup Screwed It Up

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by Tomellen, Oct 21, 2018.

  1. Oct 21, 2018
    Tomellen

    Tomellen Member

    Ticonderoga, NY
    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2016
    Messages:
    316
    1968, V6 225 ODD FIRE CJ5 WITH T86 TRANSMISSION

    Gears grind when trying to shift into first and reverse, don't know about 2nd and 3rd, didn't try them.
    Facts:
    Just put rebuild motor back in.
    Used all the same clutch parts as I had in it prior to rebuild.
    Have adjusted clutch every which way.
    Transmission turns in neutral with clutch in. yes it does.
    Clutch plate in correct.
    When stabbing motor back in on trans shaft it seemed a little tight and I closed the distance by tightening bellhousing bolts.
    I did not change pilot bearing.
    Have not tried putting in gear with motor off, pushing clutch in and trying to start. Suspect jeep will jump.
    Other background
    Crank grinder may have put in a new pilot bearing Going to check with him.
    I have read all the threads about this.
    I heave researched internet.
    I have talked to my automotive consultant:
    Associates degree in auto tech
    FULLY GM certified.
    Cadillac certified on drive trains.
    In process of Dodge certification.
    ASE certified master mechanic.
    26 yrs dealership experience.
    Hotrodder and has built his own bracket drag race motors.
    Hard worker no non sense mechanic.
    Can usually diagnose automotive problems by a verbal description of symptoms and knowing make, year and model.
    OK, JUST BRAGGING ABOUT MY SON, BUT HE IS MY GO TO GUY.

    Conclusion: Crank grinder probably put new pilot bearing in without me knowing and for some reason it is locked up with transmission shaft as a result of me pulling parts together with belling housing bolts.

    Am I upset. No was going to put new trans in next spring anyway. Will start pulling transmission and transfer case when I get back to upstate NY. Hunting in Oklahoma now.

    Your thoughts??
     
  2. Oct 21, 2018
    47v6

    47v6 junk wrecker! 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    USA
    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2006
    Messages:
    5,798
    Pull the transmission and measure the input shaft and pilot bushing. If its too small fill the pilot using with grease an get a bolt or similar round shaft, place it in the hole and smack it with a hammer. The bushing will come out unharmed. Get he correct bushing, tap it onto place and re install transmission.

    Could also be the friction disk in backwards. Could also be T/O fork.
     
    heavychevy likes this.
  3. Oct 21, 2018
    zootin

    zootin Member

    SW Oregon
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2016
    Messages:
    93
    Tomellen,

    When I rebuilt the 66 CJ5/V6 T86 Transmission, I was able to use T90 internals to do the build. However the pilot bearing that came with the clutch kit had to be reamed out by a machine shop, as it was way to tight for the main shaft to rotate. I couldn't figure out why after installation, the transmission would not rotate by hand. In the change over to the T90 internals, the only thing that I remember was I think it was the front shift fork had to be changed for the one in the T90. I was able to use the original T86 shifter with this conversion.

    Good luck,

    Frank
     
  4. Oct 21, 2018
    Walt Couch

    Walt Couch sidehill Cordele, Ga. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    cordele, Ga.
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    Mar 29, 2007
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    Input shaft diameter for pilot bearing. T-90 = .629 T-86 = .590 (inches)
     
    Jrobz23 likes this.
  5. Oct 21, 2018
    PeteL

    PeteL If it wasn't for physics, and law enforcement... 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Hills of NH
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    Aug 3, 2003
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    9,754
    I would do this with the front bumper against a tree. If there is a frictional type problem, you may be able to burn it loose. For instance, a new friction plate, or a tight pilot bearing.

    Do you have a heavy enough oil in the trans? (80/90SAE) With no synchro on 1st or reverse, the gears need to be slowed down to a standstill in order to shift those cogs.
     
  6. Oct 21, 2018
    Tomellen

    Tomellen Member

    Ticonderoga, NY
    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2016
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    316
    thanks for the suggestions. will let the group know results.
     
  7. Oct 21, 2018
    sterlclan

    sterlclan Member 2022 Sponsor

    exploring the...
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    use white bread,keeps the grease from flinging in your eye
     
  8. Oct 21, 2018
    Oldriginal86

    Oldriginal86 Member

    Pasadena, Md.
    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2014
    Messages:
    589
    I’ve mentioned this in other threads but anytime something is bolted to the back or front of an engine, crankshaft end play should be checked. Your engine builder should have noted this measurement somewhere in the paperwork you received with the engine. End play should still be the same after the trans is in. You could check it now to see if there is any. None would indicate what most are suspecting, a tight pilot bushing. Experience is a tough teacher but it’s never a good idea to pull the trans to the engine by tightening the bell housing bolts.
     
    Walt Couch likes this.
  9. Oct 22, 2018
    Tomellen

    Tomellen Member

    Ticonderoga, NY
    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2016
    Messages:
    316
    thanks
     
  10. Oct 22, 2018
    NCRenII

    NCRenII yellow fever

    Far Nor Cal
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2017
    Messages:
    431
    Was input shaft runout checked? You mentioned it was somewhat thght while stabbing.
    WAG's is new pilot beating needs sizing, or input shaft has distortion.
     
  11. Oct 22, 2018
    rejeep

    rejeep Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Rochester, NY
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    its funny (not really) how many clutch issues there are..
    im having some similar issues after R&R myself..

    Ive perhaps done 20 clutch jobs in my life and never had so many issues as I have with the dauntless motor

    ill be watching to see what you come up with..
     
    Hellion and 47v6 like this.
  12. Oct 23, 2018
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs.

    Happy Valley, OR
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2002
    Messages:
    12,529
    Sounds like a pilot bearing issue. NEVER, NEVER use the bolts to force a transmission into place. If you have to do this there is a problem and it needs addressed. A transmission should slide into place if everything is aligned properly.
     
    Hellion likes this.
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