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Right 4spd For My Cj ?

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by Buildflycrash, Jul 27, 2019.

  1. Jul 29, 2019
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2019 Sponsor

    Cottonwood, Ca
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    You might consider this route for ease of install...... Rebuilt SM-465 (GM Pattern) 4 Speed, $1100 | Herm The Overdrive Guy
    If you pay $250 for the trans, $500+ for the adapter, $ to rebuild the trans, add in your personal downtime....... I couldn't beat Herm's delivered and ready to go price when I changed to a T18. While I have had problems with Herm's overdrive, the transmission has been flawless.....
     
    Buildflycrash likes this.
  2. Jul 29, 2019
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    The 435 is a good Trans but hardly new, I had one in my 66 F100.
    I think the adapter for them is longer than a T18.
     
  3. Jul 29, 2019
    AKCJ

    AKCJ Active Member

    Fairbanks, Alaska
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    I’ve been very happy with my sm420. Use first gear quite a bit. Only paid $75 for it and didn’t need to disassemble. Novak is great to deal with.
    Question: is a T5 an option? I assume not because nobody ever talks about it. And it may be too long.
     
  4. Jul 29, 2019
    cj6/442

    cj6/442 Sponsor Sponsor

    Fallbrook, Calif
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    I went Ford t18 with granny first and a texas pattern scout d 300 t case , i'm at 80:1.... love low gears but we drive on rocks not pavement
     
  5. Jul 29, 2019
    cj6/442

    cj6/442 Sponsor Sponsor

    Fallbrook, Calif
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    my jeep had a car Muncie 4 speed and it was very nice and fast shifting like my 442.
     
  6. Jul 30, 2019
    sterlclan

    sterlclan Member Sponsor

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    The 435 is relatively short once adapted. The dodge version can be harder to adapt.
     
  7. Jul 30, 2019
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor Sponsor

    Florida Keys
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    The T5 is a car transmission that doesn't have the compound "granny" gear, though versions (4 cyl S10?) has a 1st gear in the 4.00s. T5s were used in Jeeps in the 1980s.
    -Donny
     
    AKCJ likes this.
  8. Jul 31, 2019
    Buildflycrash

    Buildflycrash Member Sponsor

    Gulf Breeze FL...
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    o_O Well that's a lot bigger than I imagined. :shock: If y'all did it I guess I can too. That's what ECJ5 is for...Helping me make my junk work.
     
  9. Jul 31, 2019
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Volvophilic

    Post Falls, ID
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    Are you otherwise happy with your 3-spd?
    Have you given any thought to lower t-case gears instead? No floorpan or driveshaft modifications necessary....
     
  10. Jul 31, 2019
    TIm E

    TIm E Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    NW Arkansas
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    That's what she.......nevermind :whistle:

    FinoCJ compiled some good research/numbers here if interested...

    4.3 Build Advice
     
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  11. Jul 31, 2019
    Renegade ll

    Renegade ll Member

    Thayne Wyoming
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    Feb 17, 2013
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    I have a 1971 cj5. I took out the T14 and installed a SM465 from Herm. It was freshly rebuilt and had the 3rd gear (whatever so it won't pop out of third gear). Warn overdrive and D-18 transfer case. The adapter is only 7/8" wide. After everything was done the only thing that it needed was a little shorter rear driveline and a little longer front driveline. I had to fabricate the trans cover and that was it. Crossmember in the same spot and only 2 spacers under the crossmember like original. Here are a few pics of the SM465 mated to the V6.

     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2019
    CJeep5, Twin2, Buildflycrash and 3 others like this.
  12. Jul 31, 2019
    jzeber

    jzeber Well-Known Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Morgan Hill, Ca
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    Great info.
     
  13. Aug 5, 2019
    sterlclan

    sterlclan Member Sponsor

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    The 435 in my 74 ended up only two inches longer than the t14 with that long bell. Also got rid of the spacers in between the crossmember and frame. Had to fab a cover for the hole in the floor which was slightly wider than the stock hole.
     
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  14. Aug 5, 2019
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    Good info...in my area at least, you can pick up a NP435 for about 1/4 the price of a T18.
     
  15. Aug 5, 2019
    sterlclan

    sterlclan Member Sponsor

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    Mine was free just had to help pull it and I had the boy do that.
     
    47v6 likes this.
  16. Aug 5, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member Sponsor

    Falcon, CO
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    As Tim said - I've done both of these - the T18 and SM465 swaps. As most have said - the SM465 is a HUGE pig compared to the others, but I like my bacon :) .

    Quick summary of my thoughts - both trannies need to be torn down and rebuilt to do it right. The T18 can be VERY confusing since there were so many different versions made to ensure you get everything back right with the right parts (even the input bearing varies). This is why I ended up doing 2 T18 setups as I had to buy mix and match parts to put them together right. You can do the T18 for a bit less than the SM465 as you can scrounge adapter plates and drill the T18 case to bolt it up, but not by much IMOP. The SM465 does need access to a press, or pay a shop to do it for the sleeves. Simple to do as there really is only ONE way to do it. The size makes the T18 attractive, but if you go by drive experience, the SM465 wins hands down IMOP. The gear splits just seem to fit much nicer together while wheeling.

    As a matter of reference - outside the tranny, the other components on the build(s) were D18, OD and I have one T18 with 4.88s as well as 5.38s and the SM465 has 4.88s. All 225 powered with EFI and swinging pedal setups.
     
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  17. Aug 5, 2019
    wasillashack

    wasillashack Member

    Wasilla, Alaska
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    Some thoughts based on my experience, I got the SM420 I used in my CJ6 for free, moving sale and the owner didn't want to move it, I posted a wanted ad on ebay and got a new AA Dana 18 adapter for ~$400, it was the type that replaced the mainshaft, which didn't concern me since I wanted to examine the innards of the SM420. AA makes 2 styles of adapter for the SM465 to Dana 18, one replaces the mainshaft, one is a stub shaft type that doesn't require a total teardown. SM 465's have at least 2 variations, the pickup SM465 has a small pilot diameter, 15/16? the medium duty SM465 in my 1972 C50 Chevy has a large pilot diameter well over an inch. I'd try to find a pickup version if I could, the large pilot could be turned or ground, but that just adds to the work involved. There may be other differences, IDK. Good luck!
     
  18. Aug 5, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member Sponsor

    Falcon, CO
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    Good to know - I have 6 of them out in the shed I collected over the years - they are all the same. But then I got them all from 4 wheelers putting autos in their rigs, and all the ones I've had in pickups (from 1/2 to 1 ton Chevy and GMC) were all the same as well. These too were all 4 wheel drive trucks (no sense in owning a 2 wheel drive truck in Colorado - at least where I've lived).
     
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  19. Aug 11, 2019
    Buildflycrash

    Buildflycrash Member Sponsor

    Gulf Breeze FL...
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    Interest in lighting the load? I’m leaving Leadville for Florida on Monday can detour thru Springs/ Falcon.
    The 465 I was looking at in Florida is gone.
     
  20. Aug 17, 2019
    willys59cj5

    willys59cj5 Sponsor Sponsor

    Gilroy, CA
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    Just throwing this out there. I’ve done the Rubicon at least 1/2 dozen times with a t90 and did just fine. I’d say it would be nice to have lower gearing, but not necessary.
     
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