My CJ6 Frankenstein Build, Little Of Everything!

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by y2k-fxst, Jul 13, 2015.

  1. Oct 23, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

    North English,IA
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    Went to the shop today and dug out the SJ Dana 44 axle to get ready to start cutting it down to fit a CJ. Was wondering what it had for a gear ratio, a very performance oriented open 3.07!

    IMGA1104.JPG

    Got it cleaned up, the SJ shock brackets cut off, and tore apart. Figured out the SJ it was under must have drove terrible before it was parked. 3 of the 4 ball joint were bad and bot u-joints in the axle shafts were bad, pinion seal and passenger side axle shaft seal was leaking, and it only had about a half cup of gear lube in it! And this came out of a full time 4x4 Wagoneer!

    IMGA1105.JPG
     
  2. Oct 23, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

    North English,IA
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    One other thing I thought I would mention. I do it out of habit over the years but, someone doing ball joints the first time might not think of it.

    After the outer-C is off the inner-C, take the adjuster sleeve out of the inner-C. Then coat it with anti-seize and run it through multiple time until it goes through easy. The passenger side inn-C threads had rust and crud built up on it and I had to actually run the sleeve in and out a few times to get it to go through. If the threads are not cleaned up, it is a possibility that when you install the new ball joints it will hit the corrosion keeping you from fully tightening. The slot in the adjuster sleeve acts like a mild tap to help clean the threads and since it will get thrown away when the new ball joints go int it's a lot cheaper than a tap that will fit those threads!

    Especially since most people don't use a scale to check the tension on the ball joints like they should.
     
  3. Oct 24, 2017
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
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    When i did mine, i run a tap inside it to chase all the rust. Did everything instruction said about pre load and final load.
     
  4. Oct 24, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

    North English,IA
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    After cutting the spring mount off and measuring 20 times, ready for the first cut.

    IMGA1106.JPG

    Note to self: If I do another axle like this, cut inner-C off first. Never thought about it since I was cutting 4" off. But, I didn't take into consideration the 1 1/16" thickness of the inner-C and the hang over in the vise jaws. Lot of finagling to get it in there square.

    IMGA1107.JPG

    Actually impressed myself how square the cut ended up being after all. Just takes forever to cut since I turned the feed pressure down to allow it to cut slow and straight.

    IMGA1108.JPG

    Axle cut to length, tubing stub cut out of the inner-C, still need to finish cleaning up the spring mount so I can weld it back on in it's new location.

    IMGA1109.JPG
     
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  5. Oct 24, 2017
    4wealn

    4wealn Member

    Ontario, Canada
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    I did the exact same thing with my Jeep. I put a front Dana 44 axle out of a 74 Cherokee Chief that was 65" WMS. I cut 4" out of the long side and had a custom axle shaft made for me from Dutchman axles. They did a great job and it was not expensive. I ground down the welds and hammered off the inner c's.
    My question is, do you know what the angle for the inner c is for when you put in back on to get a zero camber. I ended up setting the angle to zero while it was on the jack stands and it ended up having positive camber. I had ground off both inner c's to adjust the caster also.
    It is not a big deal for me as I only use the jeep offroad so it does not see pavement to wear the tires, but due to my OCD I would like to fix it and I was wondering if you knew the angle so I can fix my camber issue.
    Thank you in advance.
     
  6. Oct 24, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

    North English,IA
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    Are you talking caster or camber? I'm not going to put the inner-C back on until after I have the axle under the Jeep with the weight of the motor, trans, and transfer case on it. Since I'm going with YJ springs I will loose some of the factory caster from that. Once I have the caster set at 6 degrees I'll pull the axle back out and cut off the short side and turn it to match the long side.
     
  7. Oct 24, 2017
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member Sponsor

    Northern California
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    Don't forget your pinion angle........sometimes both of the inner C's need to be knocked off to accommodate both pinion & caster angles...
     
  8. Oct 24, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

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    Pinion angle is set by the spring mounts. It can be changed by grinding the spring mounts. especially the one that is cast into the pumpkin. With the YJ springs usually you will increase the pinion angle and decrease the caster. My pinion angle should be fairly good since this is a Wagoneer axle and the fact I'm going with a small lift.
     
  9. Oct 25, 2017
    johneyboy03

    johneyboy03 The green beast

    Quebec, Canada
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    My scout dana 44 i did grind off the C's. Since C's are press down on tube camber wasn't and issus.
    For caster i put back C's on axle but i wait until the end to weld them. I bring the jeep on a trailer to my local alignment guy and asked him to set caster to 6 degree. So he tack welded the C's and i finished the job. I have a 0.2 degree difference between each side, so it on the factory tolerance.
     
  10. Oct 25, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

    North English,IA
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    Even though it is not quite as accurate as the way you did it. I'm planning on just using an angle gauge on the long side inner-C to set my 6 degree caster. Then pull the axle and grind off the short end, and using a level set it to match the long end. If I can end up within 1-2 degree of 6 degrees I'll be happy. It's better than doing like some that end up close to 0 degrees and having to run a 6 degree caster shim!
     
  11. Oct 25, 2017
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member Sponsor

    Northern California
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    Perhaps............but unless you cut the other Inner C off your pinion angle has already been established if you continue to maintain the 6 degrees of caster your shooting for..........

    Most times we cut both inner C's off , set the pinion angle at ride height with all weight in................tack the springs hanger on , or in your case grind the housing on one side or add a shim to both as needed and then adjust the inner C's to get back to 5-7 degrees of caster.........one way can be a compromise which is fine the other way allows to get both dead on.
     
  12. Oct 25, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

    North English,IA
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    I am planning on having both inner-Cs cut off before I'm done, only have done the long side at this time. Once the Axle is under the vehicle at full weight, I will also look at the pinion angle. But, don't expect problems with that, as I have not read of pinion angle problems with the Wagoneer axle under a CJ. If I find a problem with the pinion angle, I will address that before positioning the inner-Cs.

    Also pinion angle as long as it is close will be of secondary importance. Since I'm doing a Detroit locker in the front I don't plan on high speed driving with the hubs locked in and the transfer case engaged.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2017
  13. Oct 25, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

    North English,IA
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    Got the gouges from cutting off the spring mount filled and ground. And, the spring mount welded in it's new home. Can't go any further till I get springs. Was going to finish the last body mount for the Jeep but, broke my band saw blade yesterday and don't have any more spares.

    IMGA1110.JPG
     
  14. Oct 25, 2017
    4wealn

    4wealn Member

    Ontario, Canada
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    Hey guys, I did the dame for my caster. I had the axel levelled with the weight of the jeep on it and set my angle to about 6-7 degrees and welded everything, but I have the camber set as positive (tops of both tires are pointing out compared to the bottoms). When you grind off the inner c there is also some movement for camber, or at least mine did. I set it to 0 as I made a mistake. It needs to be set to a certain degree so when the tires are back on the resulting camber is 0. That is the value I am looking for. I hope this makes sense.
     
  15. Oct 25, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

    North English,IA
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    If your talking camber, that can be adjusted with a camber shim plate behind the spindle. Not sure what year your working with but best bet would be to go to an alignment shop and have them check where you are currently are, and find out what it should be.. Camber is usually between 0 and 1 degree positive. Usually camber change is due to bent axle or inner-C, or from excessive heating from welding. As far as movement there shouldn't be any noticeable movement when the inner-C is put on the axle as the friction fit should not allow it to go on any way but straight unless you were real aggressive with the grinder cleaning the outside of the axle tube or inside of the inner-C.
     
  16. Oct 25, 2017
    4wealn

    4wealn Member

    Ontario, Canada
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    Sounds good. Thank you.
     
  17. Oct 29, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

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    Hopefully the last modification to the frame. Body mount hole is too far back and the bushing wouldn't go in. Only really needed 1" but, all I had was some 1.5" so that's what I used.

    IMGA1112.JPG

    All cleaned up and ready to put the body back on and see if my measurements were good!

    IMGA1114.JPG
     
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  18. Nov 11, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

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    Messing around out in the shop tonight, not really doing anything. Was looking at the OME YJ springs that arrived Thursday for my CJ.

    Figured out why a lot of people complain about caster angle when doing the YJ on a CJ spring swap. The top plates where the axle rests are angle shims. Most people end up running 4 rear springs when they do the conversion, since the rear springs are heavier than the front springs. With those shims it would help to point the pinion up to compensate some for the lift.

    But on the front it would still raise the pinion angle also, causing the caster to be less. If they are used with a stock CJ axle I'd either reverse the shims to get more caster or even get some flat plates made depending on how it does at the alignment shop. But, since I'm building my own axle and have already decided to do the cut and turn to correct the caster. I'll leave the plates where they are and just enjoy better pinion angle.
     
  19. Nov 12, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

    North English,IA
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    Got the OME springs under the CJ. Sat the front axle in place to see if I had the spring mounts in the right place. Fit like a glove! Just need the U-bolts to finish the install.

    IMGA1128.JPG

    Dug the 9" Ford axle for the rear out and tore it apart. Found 2 gaskets and silicone between the hog's head and the housing. While I was turning it trying to find the stampings on it to figure out the gear ratio. I noticed there was burrs on the outside of the ring gear. And, I noticed a lot of back lash so I played with it some more. Then found side play in the carrier instead of bearing preload. Threw my dial gauge on it, 0.044" side to side play! Was going to try to install the new Detroit Locker and gears myself, have never done a rear end myself. But, since I haven't found specs on the actual preload I was going to play with it some before I tore it apart. So, I'll probably take it somewhere and let someone that actually knows what they are doing build it. Figure it must be a feel thing like torquing head bolts on a iron head Harley.

    IMGA1129.JPG

    Threw the hog's head back in until I can get the new axle shafts, spiring mounts, and U-bolts.

    IMGA1130.JPG
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2017
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  20. Nov 25, 2017
    y2k-fxst

    y2k-fxst Member

    North English,IA
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    Ready to start welding my U-bolt skid plates.

    IMGA1131.JPG

    Got 3 out of 4 of them ready to drill, then ran out of welding wire. Wouldn't be so bad but, I just drove past Praxair yesterday when I picked up steel!

    IMGA1132.JPG
     
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