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Manual Saginaw In A 3b - Stock Steering Wheel

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by Warloch, Dec 18, 2019.

  1. Dec 18, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    I originally did this in my '62 build, but have had folks asking about it. I have copied the posts here for folks as it will be easier to find in searches.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2019
  2. Dec 18, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Well - here is the pics and process for the Manual Saginaw I'm putting in Jim's 3B. His goal was to make it 'keep the stock look as much as possible'. To that end, its taking me a bit longer than my normal build time on Saginaw's. I can normally do them in a weekend, if it's clean to start with, on a V6, tilt column (my 'normal' formula).

    Got a Spud shaft and base clean plate from McRuff - this box is not quite 'normal' as it's bolt pattern differs from others and power boxes. Perfect for a 'manual only' install. I did my own fit, drilled holes and cut bolts to weld into the plate.

    At any rate - here I am with about 12 hours work into it...

    Ross box removed - old column was cut because I'll be using the top on a custom plate to make the stock wheel bolt to the Speedway Hod Rod Shaft I'm using on this.

    My next step is to box the front horns and reinforce the front cross member(s). I did a bit of cleaning and then stuck a new 2x3x3/16 box tube in the front.

    After I did fitting, clean on the rails for smooth areas to weld to, welded the spring mounts better, pulled the C Shackles off (did I mention I HATE those things :censored:) to protect them from the heat, I go the Saginaw Box Plate installed.

    An here it is all bolted in place for the 'shaft work'... I normally mount my boxes higher, Jim wanted it as smooth as possible for the winch he is going to mount. I didn't have to go through the front cross member, but had some other 'up and down' issues.

    Eh - this isn't gonna be a straight line. This is the first time in many years I've done this on a 4 cyl... I drank those brain cells gone a LONG time ago so had to think it through again.

    Original plan was to take the shaft UP over and attach. This lower route actually worked pretty good. I only have to figure and mount my support bearing, drill the shafts for the locks and that part is done.

    Here you can see the Speedway Motors Shaft - it fits the stock mount for the dash and I'm putting one of their floor brackets in at the bottom. It looks like I'll be less than a half inch off from stock when I'm done. Measuring was a bit 'odd' but I am focused on trying to get the wheel back in the stock location.

    I'll work on building a plate to mount the wheel to the column when I do the support bearing.
    Column - Floor Mount

    Hope to have this done by the end of the week since I'm off, but time and other 'stuff' will tell. Work has had me out of town a lot the past few months, so the honey do list is pretty long...
     
    47v6 and 73 cj5 like this.
  3. Dec 18, 2019
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Next Up-Date - specifically the 'end of the manual Saginaw in the 3B'... Especially detailed for those wanting to keep a 'stock look' - well as close as I could and replace the normally worn out Ross parts with good stuff.

    The final piece of the front work was to figure where the support bearing needed to go. You have to put one in as I used 2 knuckles to get things to fit and flow nice.

    From there I switched to building the 'Adapter' to fit a stock steering wheel on the Speedway Column. The column comes with a 'quick disconnect hub' (though the pin on this one was broken - it comes with a bolt setup too and that is recommended for 'highway use'). My first step was to set the mounting bolts on a pattern and use them to triangulate the center I needed for the plate. The plate is 3/8" thick - more than required, but what I had on hand that would be nice and thick to support the welding on.

    The center is 15/16" and allowed a nice slip fit of the cut down column out of the Ross Steering shaft. I cleaned up the splines and threads (20NF) so I could use the stock nut and cover as well. I held it centered and square with 3 90 degree magnets. Spot welded, then went back and did back to front.
    The back was flap wheeled smooth to clear and make sure it mounted to the hub clean.

    I don't know about you guys, but the stock wheel is normally a HUGE PITA to take off. I cut the column on this one to remove it since I knew I was not keeping it any how. They come off back wards like butter :sneak:. To that point, I made sure I left room to get a wrench between the wheel and hub so it could be pulled like that if needed. My recommendation to Jim is to just glue some welting in there as most Grant adapters have a plastic collar to hide the spacing. This will let you pull it in the future if you need to easily.

    All in all - I think it looks pretty good. You would be hard pressed to tell a difference with a little paint if you want to go that far.
     
    47v6, Bowbender, metal_miner and 8 others like this.
  4. Jan 1, 2020
    metal_miner

    metal_miner New Member

    Elko, NV
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    Thank you for sharing this! What length Speedway column did you use? What is the length of your adapter?
     
  5. Jan 2, 2020
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    That is a 30" Column - I'll have to measure the adapter when I go out this weekend and finish the brakes for him. The plate is 3/8" and about a half inch for the bolt clearance to put it at the bottom of the stock steering wheel.
     
  6. Jan 3, 2020
    47v6

    47v6 junk wrecker! 2020 Sponsor

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    I like that adapter you made. I machined my 2a steering wheel to work with a speedway column.
     
  7. Jan 3, 2020
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Its one of those times when I could have justified a Mill and/or Lathe... but then I would have to remember how to use them as it's been over 20 years since I have :study:

    Did I mention I like to drink Irish Whiskey? That's also my tool of choice for brain cell recycling :crazy:
     
    47v6 likes this.
  8. Jan 3, 2020
    jeepstar

    jeepstar Well-Known Member 2020 Sponsor

    Sheboygan
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    nice work.
    i like the look of the shaft, and for under a hundred bucks, its well worth it if you are going to be getting rid the ross system.
     
  9. Jan 9, 2020
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    So - Jim came and got it a bit ago and took it home. I'll be back on my '62 build this weekend, assuming its not too cold in the shop :n:

    Got requests for a detailed set of pics on the routing of the shafts, so here they are:

    Items of note - Shaft is 3/4 Double D, knuckles can be purchased from Summit or any of the other parts places with them. Nothing fancy about any of the parts, just standard knuckles and support bearings.

    I do NOT drill all the way through the shaft, never have. I do dimple them good so the screws stay set and put light lock tight on them, both the set screw and lock nut. Never had any problems doing that.
     
  10. Jan 10, 2020
    jeepstar

    jeepstar Well-Known Member 2020 Sponsor

    Sheboygan
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    where did you get this part?
    what is this part?

    upload_2020-1-10_13-24-38.png
     
  11. Jan 11, 2020
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    That is a 'spud shaft' - McRuff here on the board makes them perfectly. You will need to know your diameter and spline count, and it goes to a 3/4 Double D for the first knuckle.
     
    jeepstar likes this.
  12. Jan 13, 2020
    jeepstar

    jeepstar Well-Known Member 2020 Sponsor

    Sheboygan
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    thank you.
    i PM'ed him :)
     
  13. Jan 18, 2020
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    I was asked for some pics of where I mount the box normally and the Pitman/Tie rod setups I use.

    This is a Manual Setup on the Blue '49
    A Drop Pitman would be nice here, I just don't have a manual one right now for it. May look at that and a tie rod flip in the future.

    And here is a Power Setup on the Red '51
    This one is actually slated for a tie rod flip some day - parts are here, just time stopping as it's not a hot need

    I mount my boxes up a bit more than others, but have never had any steering issues with them.

    When I normally box the front frame horns and get ready to mount the box, I size it for a power box, even if putting manual on it most of the time. This allows for an easy swap to power later.
     
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  14. Jan 21, 2020
    jeepstar

    jeepstar Well-Known Member 2020 Sponsor

    Sheboygan
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    I cant find any decent steering wheels to keep this stock look. They are all grant type steering. Too bad. I like the look of the stock wheel.
     
  15. Jan 21, 2020
    45es

    45es Member 2019 Sponsor

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  16. Jan 21, 2020
    jeepstar

    jeepstar Well-Known Member 2020 Sponsor

    Sheboygan
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    Nope. I believe the original is 17". This is 18".

    May and just try to duplicate what warloch did.
    I have a spare ross box setup, could sacrifice that.
    But if I could get a smaller wheel, with the improved steering, a 15" wheel would be nice.
     
  17. Jan 21, 2020
    sterlclan

    sterlclan Member

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    Look at boat wheels.
     
  18. Jan 22, 2020
    BadGoat

    BadGoat How High Can You Climb?

    St Croix, USVI
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  19. Jan 22, 2020
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    A 15" wheel helps with clearance too - for those of us that indulge in too many dark beers, or whatever (y)
     
  20. Jan 22, 2020
    Fireball

    Fireball Member 2020 Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

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    jeepstar likes this.

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