1. Registration trouble? Please use the "Contact Us" link at the bottom right corner of the page and your issue will be resolved.
    Dismiss Notice

Late Cj Locking Hub Question

Discussion in 'Intermediate CJ-5/6/7/8' started by FinoCJ, Oct 16, 2018.

  1. Oct 16, 2018
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
    Messages:
    5,629
    Were later model model cj locking hubs (D30 I assume) basically the same as the ones used on D27?

    Its a bit of a side story, but working with a friend on frankenstein YJ project that he has converted the D30 to manual locking hubs. But the locking hubs he has (which keep breaking - cheap RR stuff) use a sort of mounting flange/ring that mounts behind the wheel - I am guessing this is because of the reduction in wheel bolt pattern from 5x5.5 to 5x4.5 which I think occurred with the YJ and the automatic locking hubs.
    This is what he has:
    https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/iEkAA...5u/s-l1600.jpg

    Anyway, the discussion centers around using some old cj5 (1979) parts laying around to make some upgrades. But IIRC on my 84cj7, the locking hubs were just like the ones on my current D27, whereas the ones he has on a 1979 cj5 seem to be more like the flanged design. I am guessing his 79cj5 has had some sort of changes to it....and that has brought some confusion to our discussion that I think I am beginning to understand.
     
    FinoCJ, Oct 16, 2018
    #1
  2. Oct 16, 2018
    Daryl

    Daryl Sponsor

    Bonney Lake, WA
    Joined:
    May 25, 2006
    Messages:
    2,880
    Many of the Warn locking hubs used the same type of hub housing. There were many different bearings and bushings used however. I have swapped 10 spline cores into 27 spline hub bodies. Not all will work but there isn't anything performance related so if it fits it will most likely work. Jeep changed the hub design in 1981 to a bearing hub that only used 5 bolts but the design was still the same. The later 5 hole locking hubs were all cheap junk from day one and have been swapped out for better products on most of the Jeeps that are still on the road.
     
    Daryl, Oct 16, 2018
    #2
  3. Oct 16, 2018
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
    Messages:
    5,629
    Ok - so that answers that all the cj locking hubs were the same style...

    So then how does this 'traditional' style locking hub compare to what seems like a different mounting design with the flange. Is this flange style just a result of retrofitting manual locking hubs onto what would have been originally an auto locking hub (referring to what would have been original on a YJ). For lack of a better way to differentiate what I mean - the wheels have to be removed on this modified YJ to access the locking hub mounting bolts - whereas on our traditional cj locking hubs, the mounting bolts are all accessible with the wheel on. Is this just an issue with the reduction in the lug bolt pattern to 5x4.5, or is it something more internal to how a auto locking hub is modified to use manual locking hubs. In short - it doesn't seem possible to buy a traditional style locking hub to retro-fit onto a YJ D30 with 5x4.5 pattern.
     
    FinoCJ, Oct 16, 2018
    #3
  4. Oct 16, 2018
    DrDanteIII

    DrDanteIII Master Procrastinator

    Milford NJ 08848
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2007
    Messages:
    1,516
    you have these: (or something similar) which was part of a locking hub retrofit kit
    Alloy USA 12194 Manual Locking Hub Conversion Kit for 84-95 Jeep Wrangler YJ & Cherokee XJ

    The YJ did not have auto locking hubs originally. They were just a splined unitized wheelbearing that the axle shaft was held into by a big nut and washer. It did have a central axle disconnect but the hubs themselves never unlocked. It looked like this:
    [​IMG]

    Basically, there are probably no common parts between the cj style hubs and the kit that is on the YJ. There is not a wheel in the world that would fit a 5 on 4.5" YJ bolt pattern over an old CJ hub, which has a diameter of 4.25"

    HOWEVER!!!! The locking hubs that came with the YJ conversion share a design and probably a part number with Bronco II and Ranger hubs, so you may need to look into what those guys are running. At the very least, you might be able to find a Warn equivalent part that might last longer.


    IMHO, I'd ditch the custom hub conversion and its buffet of random parts. Then sell it off, and go back to the original unitized design with a good pair of axle shafts, with spares available at every parts store in the country.
     
    DrDanteIII, Oct 16, 2018
    #4
    FinoCJ likes this.
  5. Oct 16, 2018
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
    Messages:
    5,629
    So would going to a unit bearing hub (sort of a permanent drive flange basically?) with what is already a swapped in solid axle shaft (no disconnect at the central axle) be a huge detriment to DDing? Basically it would become one piece axle with the hubs always 'locked-in' - and not sure how feasible that is. Obviously a lot of old cjs came with drive flanges - but highway cruising and paved roads everywhere where less of a concern for what was a work utility vehicle.
     
    FinoCJ, Oct 16, 2018
    #5
  6. Oct 16, 2018
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
    Messages:
    5,629
    Yes Warn makes a recommended one...
     
    FinoCJ, Oct 16, 2018
    #6
  7. Oct 16, 2018
    DrDanteIII

    DrDanteIII Master Procrastinator

    Milford NJ 08848
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2007
    Messages:
    1,516
    Later TJ's, ZJ's, XJ's, and WJ's omitted the front axle disconnect and were locked in 100% without problems.

    Does he have a locker in the front? that could cause problems, or at least noise and wear on the locker.

    Is the original vacuum disconnect removed? It should be mid-way between the pumpkin and PS knuckle. You could re-instate that mechanism with this... 4x4 Posi-Lok Positive Axle Engagement System for Jeeps
     
    DrDanteIII, Oct 16, 2018
    #7
  8. Oct 16, 2018
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
    Messages:
    5,629
    Yes - ARB in the front. Original vacuum disconnect is completely removed (and no longer around).
     
    FinoCJ, Oct 16, 2018
    #8
  9. Oct 16, 2018
    DrDanteIII

    DrDanteIII Master Procrastinator

    Milford NJ 08848
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2007
    Messages:
    1,516
    If its an ARB it shouldn't matter since it is an open diff when disengaged. He'd probably be fine as long as he doesn't lock it on the street. Plenty of those other jeeps I mentioned are running around with ARB's in the front.
     
    DrDanteIII, Oct 16, 2018
    #9
    FinoCJ likes this.
  10. Oct 16, 2018
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
    Messages:
    5,629
    Thanks - that all makes pretty good sense!
     
    FinoCJ, Oct 16, 2018
    #10
New Posts