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Help identifying my Buick 231... At least I think it is. Thanks!

Discussion in 'Early CJ-5 and CJ-6 Tech' started by SuckerPunch, May 31, 2012.

  1. May 31, 2012
    SuckerPunch

    SuckerPunch I ated the purple berries

    TN
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    Hey all, just picked up a 70 CJ5 and the PO said it has a 231 in it. So, since I know they did not come with a 231, but came with the 225 dauntless I would like to figure out what year this engine is, if it is indeed a 231, if it is odd or even firing etc. I have tried searching and did not want to have to post the thread, but it seems like all the links to the earlycj5.com are dead now. I found some interesting threads on casting #'s etc, but they were all dead ends(none of the links work). The engine has a rochester dual jet Carb on it. Here is a picture of what I've got FWIW. Thanks for any help or info you can give me! Excited about tearing into this sucker!
    [​IMG]
     
  2. May 31, 2012
    SuckerPunch

    SuckerPunch I ated the purple berries

    TN
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    Anyone have a suggestion?? I have been googling it this afternoon and all i come up with is this link to the old .com - http://www.earlycj5.com/tech/engines/225/castingNumbers.php. this link is dead I guess since switching over to the .net. Anyone happen to have this info on the casting numbers or know where I could find it???
    Thanks!
     
  3. May 31, 2012
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs Sponsor

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    Hey, I responded to your thread over on the "other" website-your engine looks EXACTLY like my bone stock 225, so if it's swapped, they changed all the external stuff over to the new motor.
    I think all the tech articles haven't made the switch to .net yet, so I'm not sure where to find casting #'s...
     
  4. May 31, 2012
    SuckerPunch

    SuckerPunch I ated the purple berries

    TN
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    Thanks colojeepguy! Just saw your post on the "other":)rotflmao:) site. Thanks for your comments. Do you have a build thread I can check out? Hopefully the casting numbers and tech articles will get updated soon.
     
  5. May 31, 2012
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs Sponsor

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    No build thread on mine-I didn't even own a computer back then!
     
  6. May 31, 2012
    SuckerPunch

    SuckerPunch I ated the purple berries

    TN
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    LOL! :D Would love to see some pics of your 70 CJ5 viper red
     
  7. May 31, 2012
    ojgrsoi

    ojgrsoi Retired. Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Weatherford, TX
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    Here is a big FWIW.

    I had a 65 Tux that had a V-6 transplant somewhere in 1968.

    The engine stamp is on the curb side toward the front of the block. IIRC you can lean over the curb side fender and clean off the block surface that the head bolts to. The last three digits in the example below are the 139th day of the year.

    I know there was either the manifold or block casting at the rear of the manifold where it meets the block. Maybe someone will be able to fill in that gap.

    Here is the data on it. I know there is more to the codes and table but this is what I found on mine.

    Hope this helps.


    VIN 8322 12071

    8322 = CJ5A
    12071 = PRODUCTION SEQUENCE NUMBER
    MANUFACTURED IN OCTOBER 1964

    Engine stamp
    D=domestic
    P=1968
    H=225 2bbl
    1
    3 =139 equals May 18,1968
    9

    Manifold casting
    1378704 = 2 bbl

    Block casting
    991503 = produced between 1967-1984
     
  8. May 31, 2012
    sparky

    sparky done Staff Member Founder

    Toowoomba, QLD
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    225 is the most likely option, the 231 came with HEI (in most common applications).
     
  9. May 31, 2012
    wheelie

    wheelie beeg dummy Sponsor

    York, PA
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    I'm with Sparky. Sure looks like a 225. No HEI as stated above is first clue. The heat shield for the fuel pump. Looks like a cast thermostat housing vs stamped on a 231. Dollars to donuts, it's a 225.
     
  10. May 31, 2012
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs. Sponsor

    Happy Valley, OR
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    Hard to tell on my IPhone but valve covers (top of them) look angled. That is a giveaway for 231. If the swap was truly done in '68 it would have to a 225 or 198 though.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  11. May 31, 2012
    sparky

    sparky done Staff Member Founder

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    I don't think that they are angled.

    Dashpot on the intake makes me think it's not a 198 either.

    I'm sticking with my first answer, 225.
     
  12. May 31, 2012
    SuckerPunch

    SuckerPunch I ated the purple berries

    TN
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    Thanks ojgrsoi, that all makes great sense! Appreciate the info and the curbside info especially for the engine stamp info. I will have to try to get all the oil/dust/dirt/grime off the thing to find the info i need. Where are all the different casting #'s and stamps located?

    Thanks Sparky, I kind of hope it is the 225 over the 231. But really I just want to know what the stinking thing is!:) I'm pretty sure that whatever it is, it isn't the original engine. Sure would be nice if it turned out to be the original engine, but I don't have my fingers crossed.

    Yeah wheelie, it will be interesting to find out for sure what I've got.... Thanks for the info you spotted from the pic about the cast thermostat vs stamped on the 231. I never would have noticed that as I have absolutely no knowledge on these engines and early CJ's. But I cannot wait to learn everything about them.

    Thanks for all the help guys! I really appreciate it
     
  13. May 31, 2012
    SuckerPunch

    SuckerPunch I ated the purple berries

    TN
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    ah-ha! I think you may have figured it out! I wish I wsas at my office so I could run out and pop the hood, but I do think the valve covers are both slightly angled. Can't believe you could notice that from the pic! Well done. No No, swap was not done in 68. ojgrsoi was just giving me an example about his. I have no knowledge of when the swap was done. I do know that my CJ5 is a 1970. So I am thinking it was probably done in mid to late 70's or 80's..... have absolutely no information from PO.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2012
  14. May 31, 2012
    nickmil

    nickmil In mothballs. Sponsor

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    Just for more info you can install a 225 points distributor in an odd fire 231 with no issues. These types of swaps are common so I don't go by cues like that. I go by casting numbers or things that are not easily swapped. I'll take a look from my desktop tomorrow and get a better look.
    Fwiw 225 valve covers are horizontal on top unless swapped.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  15. May 31, 2012
    sparky

    sparky done Staff Member Founder

    Toowoomba, QLD
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    Eh, I go by casting numbers too, but given the fact that we don't have those to work with I'm simply going by the most obvious.

    It's not the most common thing to come across an odd-fire 231 with a 225 carburetor and distributor. Sure it's possible, but it's unlikely.

    Just working with the information we have at hand. :)
     
  16. May 31, 2012
    sparky

    sparky done Staff Member Founder

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  17. May 31, 2012
    SuckerPunch

    SuckerPunch I ated the purple berries

    TN
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  18. May 31, 2012
    SuckerPunch

    SuckerPunch I ated the purple berries

    TN
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    Thank you sir, appreciate the info!
     
  19. Jun 1, 2012
    Heatseeker

    Heatseeker Member

    Lathrop Ca.
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    Comparing your pics with my 78 even fire I notice a couple of differences. First, the PVC plugs into the intake on mine, not the valve cover. Also, the thermostat housing is pointed towards the passenger side, has the bypass hose connection cast into it and mounts on a vertical surface to the intake manifold on mine. It's hard to tell from your pic, but your thermostat housing just doesn't look like mine.

    I'm no authority on these things, just stating the couple of details that popped right out to me.
     
  20. Jun 1, 2012
    noahlon

    noahlon Old Fart

    Pine Ridge, AR
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    Looks exactly like my '68 225, except I put in a HEI and headers.
     

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