1. Registration trouble? Please use the "Contact Us" link at the bottom right corner of the page and your issue will be resolved.
    Dismiss Notice

Frame Rear Crossmember "v" Support Question

Discussion in 'Early CJ-5 and CJ-6 Tech' started by truckee4x4, Dec 8, 2018.

  1. Jun 21, 2019
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2014
    Messages:
    2,159
    I expect the KW V brace is the one you want for your '66, though I have not used theirs. Their comment about not fitting later models I think applies to the '70 - later models with the rear fuel tank.
    Keep in mind, from the factory, this fits all the way inside the frame channels, and extends past the ends of the axle crossmember. The V brace gets sandwiched between the crossmember and the frame rail and has rivets retaining it.
    -Donny
     
    truckee4x4 likes this.
  2. Jun 22, 2019
    truckee4x4

    truckee4x4 Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Truckee CA
    Joined:
    May 30, 2008
    Messages:
    126
    Thanks Donny. I'll let everyone know how it's going to fit up when it arrives in a couple weeks.
     
  3. Jun 23, 2019
    sdcj6

    sdcj6 Sponsor Sponsor

    San Diego
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2002
    Messages:
    331
    On my 71 CJ-6 with rear fuel tank the V bracing was not vertical as the earlier Jeeps and the replacement shown. The bars were flat stock, I believe 1/2 or 3/8 inch thick by about 2 inches wide. The were laid horizontal (flat) to form the V shape to make more room for the tank. They were bolted in the forward position bent down and I think I remember welded to the draw bar along the top edge. They supported the rear tank as the upper bracket. It all appeared to be factory, same amount of surface rust and splotchy paint as the frame. I made a larger tank and mounted it the same way. I don't have pictures of it, sorry.
     
    truckee4x4 likes this.
  4. Jun 23, 2019
    sdcj6

    sdcj6 Sponsor Sponsor

    San Diego
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2002
    Messages:
    331
    Apparently I am wrong on the welding part. The drawbar end was welded to a piece of right angle steel that then was bolted to the upper 2 drawbar bolts. I will try to get some pictures tomorrow.
     
    truckee4x4 likes this.
  5. Jun 23, 2019
    sdcj6

    sdcj6 Sponsor Sponsor

    San Diego
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2002
    Messages:
    331
    Right angle bracket bolted to draw bar

    Offset in V bars

    Backside of right angle bracket
    I welded the nuts to the back side
     
  6. Jul 1, 2019
    truckee4x4

    truckee4x4 Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Truckee CA
    Joined:
    May 30, 2008
    Messages:
    126
    Thanks for the pics @sdcj6.

    Update on my progress. Frame is upside down in these pics.
    20190629_GK_untitled shoot-19.jpg

    Looks to me when I line the new KW part above where it will slide into place between the frame rails when I remove the axle crossmember, it looks like like this cross member is going to be a few inches short of where it needs to extend aft to meet the rear crossmember and plate. I've just about got the rear x-member removed, going to get it off later today, and then try to cut out the rivets and pull the axle crossmember and then I'll really see where I am at. Guessing if I am right and it is short, I'll need to go buy some steel and fabricate a longer "V" crossmember and return this one.

    In the meantime, I'm also going to have to do some repairs to the frame horns:
    20190630_GK_untitled shoot-8.jpg
    What do you guys think - should I cut the shackles off and get replacements and really clean this up?
    20190629_GK_untitled shoot-15.jpg
    The welds on the pax side rear shackle tube are cracked too. As well as under the engine mounts, and the front of the frame has some cracks to weld up.
    20190629_GK_untitled shoot-6.jpg
    20190629_GK_untitled shoot-5.jpg
    20190629_GK_untitled shoot-4.jpg


    And - with all the cross member repair, I'm at the old fork in the road that many of us come to - do I really try and replace everything with rivets, or just use Grade 8 bolts and be done with it and move on? I don't have any of the specialty tools I'd need to do rivets (other than a O-A torch), so I'd be putting out a call to buddies to borrow stuff and try to learn something new. Which was of course the whole point of this entire project!

    When she rolled out of the factory in 1966 - were there any bolts on the frame/x-member connections, or were they all riveted originally?

    And - does anyone have a suggestion on how I can get the V member inside the frame rails without cutting the entire thing apart? Bend it?
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jul 1, 2019
  7. Jul 1, 2019
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2014
    Messages:
    2,159
    Almost all the frame connections are by rivet. Rivets, by the way they are set while red hot, make very tight fasteners. The rivet actually conforms by expanding to the shape of each hole. A bolt has clearance around the fastener that can allow for some movement.
    The factoy used a combimation of flat head and round head rivets.
    -Donny
     
  8. Jul 3, 2019
    Chilly

    Chilly Active Member 2019 Sponsor

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2007
    Messages:
    1,444
    When you come to a fork in the road, pick it up.

    I'd cut-off wheel the scabby welds at the rear cross member and properly butt MIG in a piece, dress to shape. I'd probably bolt up repairs but loctite with red and use washers. Shear stresses on bolted joints loosen over time.
     
  9. Jul 4, 2019
    truckee4x4

    truckee4x4 Member Sponsor 2019 Sponsor

    Truckee CA
    Joined:
    May 30, 2008
    Messages:
    126
    20190703_GK_SquawTQ-32.jpg
    Well the K-W replacement V came up about 3" short as I suspected. @Keys5a so does that mean that in 1964 the frame got a few inches longer?

    I cut the V and I'm going to get some C-Channel and splice it, after correcting the angles to match. Once I get it fabricated I will take a bunch of measurements and post them here in case anyone else ever needs to do the same thing, which would be substantially easier to just start with C-channel and bend your own.

    Of course this beauty has been sitting in our community shop for three months just waiting to be hooked up, but since it's not in operation yet I had to use a cut off wheel. 20190703_GK_SquawTQ-23.jpg

    The good news regarding the rivets is that one of my friends owns a blacksmith shop in town and he has an air hammer he's going to bring over one day after work next week so we're going to try the hot rivets once all the frame repairs are done. I ended up having to get a replacement front cross member too, when we got it off last night it was swiss-cheesed with Bubba holes, completely beat out of shape, and wavier than the ocean. I'll document the riveting in a separate thread cause it's going to be fun!
     
  10. Jul 4, 2019
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2014
    Messages:
    2,159
    To the best of my knowlege, the frames of flat fenders and 5s are pretty much the same in the rear portion. I'll blame the 3" shortage on an Omix part which sometimes "resembles" the original parts. I'm disappointed the V-brace misses the mark that badly as I need to replace two of them. I'm pretty sure Omix is the only replacement supplier.
    -Donny
     
  11. Jul 4, 2019
    Howard Eisenhauer

    Howard Eisenhauer Super Moderator Staff Member Sponsor

    Tantallon, Nova...
    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2003
    Messages:
    5,737
    5's are two inches longer in the back than 2's/3's, if you ever see a 2 or 3 body someone has mounted on a 5 frame you'll see frame stickout in the rear.
     
  12. Jul 4, 2019
    CHUGALUG

    CHUGALUG New Member

    Silverton, OR
    Joined:
    May 11, 2019
    Messages:
    13
    Keep in mind the CJ5 frame is about 2" longer from the riser to the rear then the Flat Fender frames. And I have a 2A tub on a 5 frame. And my tub doesn't stick out course I have done extensive reworking to the rear section of the frame.
     

Share This Page

New Posts