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CJ3B Beastie

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by browncoat, Apr 15, 2017.

  1. Aug 16, 2017
    Desertdave66

    Desertdave66 Member

    Fl
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2017
    Messages:
    63
    Dang it man you got skills. I couldn't even think if attempting something like this. I'll rip open a can of XXXX for ya mate, in your honor!
     
  2. Aug 16, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
    Messages:
    410
    Thanks Dave, it's easier if you have a equipment and a lifetime of working with metal as a background. :)

    Finished the bellhousing today. Faced off the bellhousing face so it is parallel to the rear face.
    [​IMG]

    Then a paint job
    Because every weld looks better with a coat of paint.(y)
    [​IMG]
     
  3. Aug 16, 2017
    Focker

    Focker That's a terrible idea...What time? Staff Member

    WA
    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2014
    Messages:
    7,540
    Really, really cool...Great fab work!
     
  4. Aug 17, 2017
    Muzikp

    Muzikp Active Member

    Sacramento Ca.
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2016
    Messages:
    1,450
    Pffft! I could do that, you know... if I knew what it was he was doing.

    Ok I'm impressed, looking forward to seeing this come together.
     
  5. Aug 24, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
    Messages:
    410
    Some decisions just get made for you when you're rebuilding.
    Decided to inspect the front brakes to see what I needed to order and discovered that there wasn't anything behind the cover plate.
    Seems they got scavenged by the previous owner at some stage and it wasn't mentioned when I purchased.
    [​IMG]
    So that makes the decision to go with front discs an easy choice.

    Rear brakes are intact but need new shoes and new cylinders.
    Please don't judge my hub puller to harshly, its ugly but works, even though I had to heat the hub to break the taper lock after so many years in place.
    [​IMG]

    Down here we don't have access to a lot of the different models and makes of vehicles that you guys do to source parts for upgrades, so this is my plan to use what is generally available here at a reasonable cost.
    Suzuki Sierra 83 - 96 models 10mm thick solid brake discs - 60 bucks on ebay.
    Holden commodore (GM) rear disc brakes from a VB to VS model are the same thickness and close to same diameter as above and the pads will always be available. 95 bucks at the wreckers
    Hoses will be later model Jeep with the banjo bolt fitting and the caliper mount plates will be fabricated.

    While pulling things apart on the front I have found the uni joints in the left axle are totally flogged out so will be doing both sides.
    The diff gears look OK and nothing jumps out as wrong there. Will confirm that once the axles come out.

    The right hand drive steering setup is even more of a nightmare than the normal LHD way so power steering is going to be installed.
    Got a full setup off a toyota hilux that I should be able to mount creatively.
    The box will be above and outside the chassis on the right side just behind the front spring hanger.

    Having a good time so far but there is a long road ahead.:cool:
     
    ojgrsoi, ITLKSEZ and 47v6 like this.
  6. Aug 25, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
    Messages:
    410
    The disc sitting on the hub with the caliper where I think I will be mounting it.
    Disc is 11.5 inches diameter.
    Also ordered the extended studs today.
    [​IMG]

    Now I am just learning as I go here, so if anyone see's something about to go wrong please speak up.

    Is there a consensus on where is the best place to mount the caliper?

    I am thinking at 12 o'clock as shown to keep it as high as possible or is there a better spot forward or behind 12 o'clock that makes a difference to the braking?
     
  7. Aug 25, 2017
    Focker

    Focker That's a terrible idea...What time? Staff Member

    WA
    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2014
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    7,540
    I think 9ish/10 is more common.
     
  8. Aug 25, 2017
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Hope for the best, prepare for the worst

    Liberty Lake, WA
    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2015
    Messages:
    6,648
    No difference in braking, but you might want to make sure they clear the kingpins (in case you want to pull the caps without having to remove the calipers first). I usually try to clock mine so the bleader valve is positioned at the highest point to ensure no air bubbles get trapped, which in your case would be back just a hair to get your bleader higher than your banjo bolt.
     
  9. Aug 25, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
    Messages:
    410
    Good idea on the bleed valve, I think I will rotate it back another mounting hole.

    Most pics seem to show them mounted back where Focker say's at around 9 to 10 o'clock, so if the bracket I will make can be indexed back 60 degrees at a time so I can try it in all the positions if I want to.
     
  10. Aug 25, 2017
    Walt Couch

    Walt Couch sidehill Cordele, Ga. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    cordele, Ga.
    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2007
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    5,908
    Sounds like a good Plan.
     
  11. Aug 26, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
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    410
    Plan followed Walt, and pleased with the look of them.(y)

    I did some measuring and came up with the dimensions needed. I am making the caliper bracket out of 10mm plate (3/8").
    It will also require a 3.5mm spacer on that as well to get the caliper mounting centrally over the disc so those spacers got welded on and blended to the 10 plate.

    Centre hole was oxy cut then cleaned out to final size with a die grinder to 70mm diameter which is a snug fit over the hub spigot step.

    Marked out the holes on the plates, then used the spigot to confirm and match drill.
    [​IMG]

    After chamfering all the holes it fitted neatly. left side.
    [​IMG]

    Heres a pic with the caliper in place, left side.
    [​IMG]


    And, the right side with caliper and disc in place attached to the hub.
    [​IMG]


    Now I need to decide if these need "dustcovers" or if it is acceptable practice to leave the discs exposed?

    I can see some advantage in stopping an occasional stone from hitting the disc but is there any risk of serious damage considering the brake disc is virtually hidden inside the tyre rims?
    Opinions??
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2017
    ojgrsoi, Walt Couch and ITLKSEZ like this.
  12. Aug 28, 2017
    masscj2a

    masscj2a Member 2023 Sponsor

    Ware, Mass
    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2013
    Messages:
    743
    I never put the dust backing plates on anymore. They just seem to collect dirt, mud and stones. Have not had a problem without them.
     
  13. Aug 28, 2017
    WestCoastPat

    WestCoastPat Member

    Orting, WA...
    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2015
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    132
    I wish I could follow this build, but all I see is "X img" instead of pictures. Mr. Focker- any ideas? WCP
     
  14. Aug 28, 2017
    Focker

    Focker That's a terrible idea...What time? Staff Member

    WA
    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2014
    Messages:
    7,540
    What browser are you using?
    Internet Explorer?
    Firefox?
    Chrome?
    etc...
     
  15. Sep 5, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
    Messages:
    410
    Have been fiddling around with the steering box and the body position on the frame over the last little while, and got around to slipping the engine onto the chassis to assess the positioning and try to see any interference issues before they become too big a problem.

    First the engine and gearbox with the bellhousing conversion between them.
    [​IMG]

    Other side.
    [​IMG]

    Then sat it on the chassis where I have calculated it to be the best position.
    I had already worked out where the body sits in relation to the axle centres and marked the firewall position on the chassis.

    [​IMG]

    There is an issue with the sump probably being in the way of the front prop shaft at full compression so I may have to modify the sump a little.

    If I lift the engine any more it looks weird even though it would make it clear the sump.
    [​IMG]

    In the position it is in at the moment the bottom of the sump is half way down the frame rail so it is very protected.
    I think the added T shape at the bottom of the sump is intended to increase oil capacity to help with engine temp maybe???

    Anyway, the side view.
    [​IMG]

    There is around 2 inches or more of gap back to the firewall so plenty of room for some insulation and running hoses and wiring .

    Plenty of room for the radiator and grille.
    And still playing with that steering box to see where it will fit best.

    Decided to put the motor in so I can make sure the path from the steering column to the box will not be obstructed.
     
    Hellion likes this.
  16. Sep 5, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
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    410
    Removed the under seat toolbox, it needs a lot of work.
    I will also have to modify the toolbox somewhat later on as the shift lever for the transfer case comes up inside where the toolbox sits.


    The tunnel will be a full custom job to make this work.
    Idea is the make the cover with incorporated storage spaces.

    The Daihatsu 5 speed is a lot bulkier on top than the original T90 and the shift levers are further to the rear.

    Steering column is out of an old Mitsubishi 4WD ute. That lets me have the headlight dipping and hazard light switch on the column rather than on the dash and floor like normal.

    Better pic loaded
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2017
    Bowbender, Rich M. and 47v6 like this.
  17. Sep 6, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
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    410
    With the engine in place I decided to go ahead with the engine mounts.
    [​IMG]
    These need to be approved by the auto engineer before I weld them in so they will be tacked in place for a while.
    I will also add a few gussets to ensure they pass the engineers scrutiny.

    [​IMG]
     
  18. Sep 6, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
    Messages:
    410
    With the engine mounts in position it has highlighted the drama I would have with the steering box if I had mounted it inside the chassis rail like I was considering doing.

    The Isuzu 4FB1 engine has a small oil cooler and the oil filter that would have made the path from the steering column impossible. So it will definitely have to live on the outside of the chassis like it does on the Toyota's that it came from.

    [​IMG]

    I had considered sinking the steering box into or under the front cross member and getting it lower to align the drag link and tie rod a bit better, and it would have avoided the springs, the idea being it would have allowed the suspension to articulate fully without the drag link passing above the springs and hitting when compressed.

    The drama with that was it made the pitman arm very exposed under the front and the geometry of the box meant I would have had to mount it too far toward the centre line of the chassis for the steering shaft to get to it easily.

    So plan B is to mount the steering box up higher on the chassis, on the outside.
    The reasons for that are;
    because it needs the incoming steering shaft to clear the shocky mount, and the pitman arm needs to clear the highest point of the spring travel.

    Much measuring and then a 1 ton chain pulley pulling the axle up to the bump stop shows me the spring would clear the draglink even at full compression of the spring.

    Plus if I do a tie rod flip to minimise the drag link angle down to the tie rod it would become a similar angle to the original geometry.
    Research shows me the options to do the flip is by drilling out and putting in shouldered inserts or reaming the hole and using a tapered insert.

    The 2 knuckle holes need to be done and the drag link to tie rod connection also needs to be flipped around.

    Question, is the same reversing process used on the tie rod end that the drag link goes to?
    This critter is the one I mean.
    [​IMG]
    It is also going to be bent the wrong way when it flips over to the top of the knuckle arm but does that really make a difference?
     
  19. Sep 7, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
    Messages:
    410
    Made the mount for the power steer box today.

    [​IMG]

    Remembered to lift the axle up to normal height before settling on the position.
    That minimized the angle of the drag link a lot.
    I forgot that detail yesterday when I was worrying about angles.


    [​IMG]

    The chassis is sandwiched between the shaft on the outside and the plate inside and the bolts thread into the plate.

    If the engineer thinks it is required, I will weld this bracket into the chassis later.
     
    47v6 likes this.
  20. Sep 15, 2017
    browncoat

    browncoat Member

    Maitland Australia
    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2016
    Messages:
    410
    Got approval from the engineer for the mounts so time to get the rest of the chassis up to scratch before the welding is started.

    The rear V brace was beat up and damaged so I am getting rid of it and replacing with a more substantial rear cross member.

    Because this is an early CJ5 chassis it is a bit longer than required for the 3B body so I am trimming off about 2 inches of damaged and rough looking side rail, level with the rear of the spring hanger, along with the V brace.

    I plan on putting 2 fuel tanks in this eventually so it will have the original under seat as well as a later cj5 style up between the chassis rails behind the diff.
    Long range cruising.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2017
    ojgrsoi likes this.
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