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71 Wheeling Rig

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by Fireball, Jan 18, 2021.

  1. Apr 6, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2018
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    2,248
    The first part of tonight's work was tangentially Jeep related. The jack on our flatbed trailer hangs down too low. We blasted it turning around in a vacant lot on the Colorado trip last year:
    [​IMG]

    We pulled it mostly back with a ratchet strap. We stopped at Tractor supply and bought a rotating jack to install when we got home:
    [​IMG]

    That was last August and the new Jack has been taking up space on my bench ever since. I had the trailer on the truck to deliver a tractor, so it was time to finally fix it. Here you can see where the old jack completely tore out the lower mount:
    [​IMG]

    I bought a weld-on bracket for the new jack. Paint removed:
    [​IMG]

    Clamped in place:
    [​IMG]

    And done. This gives us a good 4 inches more ground clearance when folded up and should solve the problem:
    [​IMG]

    Then I had my wife help with the driver's seat bolts to remove these spaces. The PO said he put them in so he could see better:
    [​IMG]

    Much easier for me to get in and out of now and seems more comfortable:
    [​IMG]

    Then is was time to hack up my new shroud. After going at it with the cutoff wheel:
    [​IMG]

    And then smoothing with the flapper wheel:
    [​IMG]

    Touched up the paint and reinstalled it. Now I've got a nice 1" clearance all around with no close spots:
    [​IMG]
     
  2. Apr 6, 2021
    47v6

    47v6 junk wrecker! 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    USA
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    Those seat spacers.. Did you buy this jeep from a garden gnome?
     
    Snoops, fhoehle, homersdog and 3 others like this.
  3. Apr 6, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    He wasn't that short! I don't know what his deal was. I'm guessing he really did it so the seats were about the same height. The passenger one sits higher now unless I make a custom mount for it.
     
  4. Apr 6, 2021
    givemethewillys

    givemethewillys Been here since sparky ran it. 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    New Kent, VA
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    This drives my wife NUTS about my Jeep, and if I'm being honest, annoys me too. It'll be something I'll be changing once I get to that point of my project.
     
    Fireball likes this.
  5. Apr 7, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2018
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    My wife has spring fever so we ran into town for plants. As a result I didn't get as much time with the Jeep.

    I did some prep for the spring swap. Marked up Warrior Products 6 degree 2" caster shims to trim them down to 1 3/4" where the U-bolts go:
    [​IMG]

    Sparks like them hot-rod TV shows!
    [​IMG]

    No ridicules timelines or huge fights though. I'll have to work on that.

    Drilling the center bolt holes for 3/8" center bolts:
    [​IMG]

    Clamping the springs together so I can pull the center bolt and not have to line it all back up to put it back in:
    [​IMG]

    The center bolt is free!
    [​IMG]

    Reinstalled with the shim and tightened with Channel Locks on the head and a impact gun. I had to file a couple marks left from the channel locks:
    [​IMG]

    One interesting issue, and maybe others can help here. The instructions say, and I quote "The #004252 is the front spring. Install is so the numbered end of the spring is forward".

    The spring has numbers on both ends!
    [​IMG]

    I'm assuming they meant the number in the previous sentence so I put that forward. That puts two bolted clamps on the front half of the spring and a single bent clamp on the back of the spring. Bolted clamps to prevent fanning in front and bent clamp to prevent torque distortion in the rear??? I don't know.

    And painted. Maybe I'll have time to get a couple springs installed tomorrow night:
    [​IMG]
     
  6. Apr 8, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2018
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    Got the front springs done tonight.

    In the service position:
    [​IMG]

    Old spring vs new. The leaves are a lot thicker on the old one:
    [​IMG]

    I discovered my shackles and bolts need to be replaced. It looks like they weren't torqued tight enough and the weight of the Jeep was sitting on the bolts:
    [​IMG]

    Wallowed out hole in the shackle:
    [​IMG]

    I'm putting these back for now so I can see how the springs feel but I've ordered a set of 4 from Walcks. Depending on desired ride height I may end up making my own shackles and the Walcks ones will be spares for the '69.

    It looks like I chose the wrong numbers on the springs to put forward. The bolted clamps are really close to the steering linkage:
    [​IMG]

    I double checked against Jame's build thread and sure enough he has them on the other way around: Fino's 1970 Mini Build Thread. So I flipped the wedges.

    Other spring out:
    [​IMG]

    Both new springs in:
    [​IMG]

    The new shocks came with the bushings out:
    [​IMG]

    So I used the vice to push them in:
    [​IMG]

    And I used the vice push in the sleeves. Then I pushed them back out again when I realized they aren't used on CJs:
    [​IMG]

    Shocks installed:
    [​IMG]

    Back on the ground and spring/shackle bolts torqued. It's definitely softer. It actually moves when you push down on the bumper now:
    [​IMG]

    It seems to sit about an inch lower. Once I get the back done, I'll have to flex it out and see if the tires clear the fenders. If not I'll have to decide on longer shackles to lift it back up a bit, bringing down the bump stops, or both. If the tires clear, I'd like to keep it an inch lower for a lower CG and better road manners.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021
  7. Apr 8, 2021
    Madeline3b

    Madeline3b Optimized for analog

    PNW
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    Feb 19, 2021
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    85
    Looking good there bud.
     
    Fireball likes this.
  8. Apr 9, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    Busted butt to get the rear springs done tonight so I could go for a test drive.

    One down, one to go:
    [​IMG]

    The sun had just gone down as Test Engineer Emmett and I headed out:
    [​IMG]

    Took off across a farm field and you can go easily 3 or 4 times faster than with the old rock-hard springs. After that, we went a couple miles down the road hitting every pothole. It's no Cadillac, but it's sooooooooooo much better with the BDS springs. Perfectly acceptable now and I hear they'll get even softer when broken in. The driveline vibration I had at 40mph is gone with the new springs and no shims in the back. I really happy with the transformation some bolt on parts can make.

    For fun, I crossed it up in the ditch to look at tire clearances. The front tires tuck up into the fenders just fine. All 4 tires are still firmly on the ground, so it still has more flex in it:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Even better, the fan doesn't hit the new radiator or shroud when the frame is flexed. I'll try to find a deeper ditch in the daylight this weekend and see if I can find the limits.

    However, the springs don't sit the Jeep level. Hard to tell in this picture but the front of the rocker panel is almost an inch lower than the back:
    [​IMG]

    I've ordered some material to make longer front shackles to bring it up 3/4" or so. I'm leaving the back as is. I'll drive the Jeep around more and start working on the transfer case while I'm waiting for shackle parts.
     
  9. Apr 9, 2021
    47v6

    47v6 junk wrecker! 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

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    When you put longer shackles up front it reduces your caster. Just something to think about.
     
    Ol Fogie likes this.
  10. Apr 9, 2021
    Ol Fogie

    Ol Fogie 74 cj5 304, 1943 mb 2020 Sponsor

    Jasper Georgia
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    x2, Also if the increase in lift with the softer springs there may be increase in body roll or lean in the curves at highway speeds. A stabilizer bar added to the front could help if that if needed.
     
    Fireball likes this.
  11. Apr 9, 2021
    Renegade ll

    Renegade ll Member

    Thayne Wyoming
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    Feb 17, 2013
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    Again Roy great work!!! When I did my jeep I added the BDS springs and new body mounts and the ride was very nice.
     
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  12. Apr 9, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    Yeah, that's one of the reasons I choose 6 degree shims. Based on FinoCJ's Jeep and others I expected to need longer shackles. With 6 degree shims I should still have some caster.

    I'll have to measure the caster and driveline angles tonight to see where everything is at.
     
  13. Apr 9, 2021
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Having an avatar identity crisis

    Post Falls, ID
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    My biggest complaint with longer shackles up front (any shackles up front, actually), is banging them into rocks and messing up the main leaf. The longer the shackle, the worse the issue. Huge pet peeve of mine.

    Anyway, glad to hear it’s soft enough for your liking! I know you were worried about it.
     
    Fireball likes this.
  14. Apr 9, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    Agreed. I'm a little disappointed the springs have such a rake to them. I don't want shackles tall enough to get all that out, but at least some. ...or maybe I should just wait until I get a tire tack and spare on the back. That might level it out.
     
    Muzikp, Rich M., Norcal69 and 2 others like this.
  15. Apr 9, 2021
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Northern California
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    X2
    When you get dogs, ice chest, spare tire ect.... you will probably be about right.
     
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  16. Apr 9, 2021
    Rich M.

    Rich M. Shoe pusher

    Maryland
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    I have 1" longer shackles and got frightening bump and roll steer making for white knuckle driving. I too have a forward " rake" with my Superlift softrides. I think once I add the rear carrier and jack for Colorado :D it will level out.
    After discussion with a couple of guys here I think the simple, cheap solution is to do a shackle reversal.
     
    Fireball likes this.
  17. Apr 9, 2021
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Northern California
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    I should add that I intentionally set my rig up with about 3/4" rake.
    Fully prepped for the rubicon/multiple day camping trips with a full fuel load I sag 3/4" or so in the rear. As fuel gets used, ice melts, food eaten, beer drank..... the back end slowly comes up to approximately level.
     
  18. Apr 9, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    I should probably just leave it as is and put the new stock length shackles on the front (when they show up) since the tires don't seem to have clearance issues.
     
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  19. Apr 9, 2021
    47v6

    47v6 junk wrecker! 2021 Sponsor 2020 Sponsor

    USA
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    I ran stock YJ shackles on my 2a and set the caster to 7 degrees and welded the YJ spring perches on. It really handled great. Perfect wheel return, no bump steer, stable as can be.

    I got some 2” lift shackles that improved my spring rate a bit and they seem to articulate a bit better... these are high arch 4” lift YJ springs.. it’s brought my caster to about 4.5. While it still is fine, it’s not as awesome as it was.
     
    Fireball likes this.
  20. Apr 9, 2021
    Timber Cruiser

    Timber Cruiser Member

    Oregon
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    I've got the procomp lift on mine and ended up changing to 3/4" longer shackles to get it closer to level. Unfortunately it still has a rake. I was hoping putting the Meyers top on would level it out, but it didn't. 6 degree shims were enough to fix my caster issues, so I think you would be good there. I wonder how much heavier your 350 is over the v6. I have a pretty heavy bumper and winch, so I've always assumed that was giving me the problem.
     
    Fireball likes this.

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