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Saginaw Power Steering (pics) Please Add Yours!

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by Mcruff, Aug 5, 2005.

  1. Jun 21, 2022
    Fastford5913

    Fastford5913 New Member

    Bakersville nc
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    May 29, 2022
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    Thanks for the info guys
     
  2. Dec 13, 2022
    Jw60

    Jw60 Sitting up n buckled down. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Sedalia MO.
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    Does anyone have a link to where they purchased the base of stock column u-joint and bushing. It looks like it needs to be .875 ID.
    Mucho gracious.
     
  3. Dec 13, 2022
    1947cj2a

    1947cj2a Member

    PNW
    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2017
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    223
    I used AA parts. Machined the factory column down
     
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  4. Dec 27, 2022
    BadGoat

    BadGoat How High Can You Climb?

    Northern Virginia
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    Apr 27, 2017
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    326
    I'll add mine as well.
    I converted my bell cranks steering to power using the following.
    Advanced Adapters conversion kit to allow use of the stock steering column and wheel.
    Jeep ZJ(Grand Cherokee) steering box. The ZJ boxes are a fast ratio (12.7:1) box and readily available either at a junkyard or remanufactured.
    Double u-joint to clear the headers and the LS motor mounts. The steering shaft routing required two carrier bearings with a total of four u-joints (2-single and 1-double).
    I was working in the Caribbean at the time and couldn't find anyone to make me custom hoses, so I converted all the house ends to an-6 and made my own.
    The return hose is a standard -6 braided line rated for hydraulic fluid. The pressure line is a DIY kit from PSC steering.

    Between the steering conversion and the shackle reversal, the Jeep steers very well at both low and high speeds. Low speed is effortless, high speed 70-80 mph tracks smooth and easy. I do have a little extra play due to the double u-joint, but it doesn't bother the wife.

    ZJ steering box with an-6 line adapters.

    View of the steering shaft from the box to the first carrier bearing (heim joint)

    Closeup of the heim mount.

    View of the double u-joint

    View of the second heim joint/carrier bearing after the steering shaft comes through the firewall. And yes it is very close to the exhaust header, but it does clear.

    Mike
     
  5. Dec 27, 2022
    vtxtasy

    vtxtasy oldbee 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor

    Tucson, AZ
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    Mike[/QUOTE] The ZJ boxes are a fast ratio (12.7:1) box and readily available either at a junkyard or remanufactured.

    Mike,I have question for you on the steering box and have not researched why they call 12.7:1 a fast ratio. My Saginaw is 4.1:1
    and takes 2 turns from bump-stop to bump-stop installed. It is 4.1:1 turns to where the box alone stops. It doesn't take much
    input to make a steering change. I believe I have a shorter pitman arm to try. Or I am thinking about this wrong.
    That said, it would appear that you would have close to 6 turns and less twitchy on the input and not even need power.
    Do you happen to know what your stop to stop is?

    Edit: Looked it up...12.7=3-1/2 turns...16.0=about 4 turns. So, maybe mine is not so twitchy.
    They went as high as 24:1 but I am not sure what models these were in. It does not
    appear that Saginaw ever made one. Only in manual steering. Answered my own questions.
    Funnily, I researched this before but was confused on the fast part. Mine is fast enough...lol!

    Thanks, John
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2022
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  6. Dec 28, 2022
    BadGoat

    BadGoat How High Can You Climb?

    Northern Virginia
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    Apr 27, 2017
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    326
    The length of the pitman arm should be approximately equal to the distance from the center of the ball joint/kingpin to the center of the drag link (or tie rod for y-link steering setups) connection to the knuckle. A shorter pitman arm will decrease the swing arc length and reduce the amount of steering angle available at the wheels. It should also slightly reduce the steering effort required and the speed of the steering. A longer pitman arm will increase the swing arc length of the pitman arm and increase the amount of steering angle available at the wheels, up to the limits of the steering stops on the axle. It should also slightly increase the steering effort required and the speed of the steering.

    Another point to consider with pitman arms and steering box placement is the geometry of the drag link and the tie rod at both full suspension compression and full droop. If you retained the original front spring configuration, the axle will move forward at full compression, and you don't want the pitman arm and drag link interfering with the tie rod. I'm running a shackle reversal, so while my axle is moved forward an inch or two from stock, it moves rearwards under compression. Even so, with my steering box placement, a set of 1 1/2" diameter tie rod and drag link would not work for me. It would bind at the point where they approach parallel. I had to switch to a 1 1/4" diameter set from Parts Mike.

    Mike
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2022
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  7. Jan 15, 2023
    Jw60

    Jw60 Sitting up n buckled down. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Sedalia MO.
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    Does anyone have pictures of the stock column getting cut down?
    From what I've gathered you cut the shaft and outer tube is cut an inch shorter then the shaft. bushing is installed and the u-joint yoke is against the bushing tight due to the spring so it's a two person operation one holding the spring down and one drilling thru for the first set screw.
     
  8. Jan 15, 2023
    BadGoat

    BadGoat How High Can You Climb?

    Northern Virginia
    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2017
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    326
    I did mine by myself, so you don't need two people to do it. The u-joint does not hold the bushing in place and the shaft can be cut more than 1 inch from the outer tube end. The bushing is driven on with a mallet and is a pretty tight fit. Here are some pictures.

    The shaft cut and prepped for the bushing.

    The end of the shaft with the bushing installed, the U-joint mounted, and the whole column installed in the Jeep as a test fit.

    Mike
     
  9. Aug 11, 2023
    colojeepguy

    colojeepguy Colorado Springs

    At the foot of...
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    I've never understood this...what compresses the spring under the steering wheel? What holds the shaft in place?
     
  10. Aug 11, 2023
    Jw60

    Jw60 Sitting up n buckled down. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Sedalia MO.
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    The AA instructions have the lower yoke tight to the bushing compressing the bearing.
    There should be shims, spacers, or an additional collar if the bearing is not compressed a little.
     
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  11. Aug 11, 2023
    Jw60

    Jw60 Sitting up n buckled down. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Sedalia MO.
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    Here is how mine turned out, I cut the shaft as long as I could then even used a double u-joint for another inch. There is an additional set screw collar holding the pressure from the upper spring.
    [​IMG]20230424_132141 by Joe with a jeep, on Flickr
     
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  12. Aug 17, 2023
    KarlWithaK

    KarlWithaK New Member

    Austin, TX
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    Feb 1, 2016
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    This might not be relevant to the most recent posts but thought I'd post up pics of my steering setup with saginaw power steering. I also have a '98 4.3 Vortec (Chevy Blazer), narrowed Dana 44 front with spring over, and some custom machining that I did on an exhaust manifold from a mid 90's-ish Astro Van. I've also added a PS cooler under the which mount as well but I forgot to snap a photo.

    Pre-4.3 Install:

    Post 4.3 Install:
     
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  13. Aug 20, 2023
    Buildflycrash

    Buildflycrash More or Less in Line. 2024 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Gulf Breeze FL...
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    Is there a “best” Saginaw power gear? Year make model? I have a core and want a new or rebuilt box.
     
  14. Aug 20, 2023
    Rich M.

    Rich M. Shoe salesman 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Maryland
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    I have to be honest, from a point of safety. The spacer block on the drag link at the knuckle doesn't give me a warm and fuzzy feeling. There's potential for a lot of stress and premature wear. The heim discussion has been had multiple times. My state wouldn't pass them on inspection for a tagged vehicle. Ymmv
    Not trying to bag, otherwise your fab work looks great.
     
  15. Aug 20, 2023
    KarlWithaK

    KarlWithaK New Member

    Austin, TX
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    Fair point and I’ve never though much of it in the 25 years it’s been set up like that. That’s a lot of height for a single shear joint. Probably worth me taking a few minutes to take it apart and having a closer look.
     
  16. Aug 21, 2023
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    Not only is it a lot of height for single shear, it doesn't have any real misalignment clearance when the axle flexes. It seems like you should be using a high misalignment heim joint like this: https://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/R2112.html or some cone spacers on both sides of the existing joint so it can flex more without bottoming out like these: https://www.ebay.com/itm/325721300877
     
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  17. Oct 29, 2023
    Ol Fogie

    Ol Fogie 74 cj5 304, 1943 mb

    Southern...
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    Was looking at my power steering gear, appears to be a about a 1/8 hole in the casting. No fluid leaking from it. Is this normal? A vent of some sort? IMG_4823.JPG
     
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  18. Oct 30, 2023
    vtxtasy

    vtxtasy oldbee 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor

    Tucson, AZ
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    I just don't know. Mine does not have it. Looks to good to be a casting flaw.
     
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  19. Oct 30, 2023
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Hope for the best, prepare for the worst

    Liberty Lake, WA
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    I always assumed it was a hole to fit a punch through to get the snap ring started for removal. I’ve never checked which way the hole goes.

    The box on my 3b has it.
     
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  20. Nov 25, 2023
    timsresort

    timsresort Active Member 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    South Lake Tahoe CA
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    Sorry I am so late, but yes, a hole to get a drift in to get the snap ring out.
    [​IMG]
     
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