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Small Tig Machines

Discussion in 'The Tool Shed' started by Danefraz, Oct 24, 2016.

  1. Nov 19, 2016
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

    St. Charles,...
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    Well I honestly would prefer the somewhat time proven Miller Dynasty 200 or perhaps the newer 210.
    The Miller price tag is proportionately much higher.
    Good used Millers are pretty scarce around here.
     
  2. Nov 19, 2016
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
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    That's interesting...............In what you say about voltage switching.............Is that an Inverter Machine? ....................on the older dual voltage Miller machines they supplied two plugs that required being put together to get to 115v, when plugged together it's a standard 3 prong 115 v plug out the one end , by itself it's a 4 prong 4 leg standard 220 volt plug..............By reading what you stated it's sounds as if someone used the machine at 115v and then plugged it into 220V and cooked it?..............are you saying they somehow used the 3 leg 115v then plugged it into 220v? Or rewired the plug?

    I looked on Lincolns website and they make it sound like in order to convert voltage back and forth.......you must rewire another plug???.......(see below)......or do they supply a converter plug much like Miller does?

    A suitable 115V attachment plug must be installed on the power cord to use the V205-T with a 115V input supply. The rated output of the V205-T is available when connected to a 30A branch circuit. When connected to a branch circuit with lower amp rating, lower welding current and duty cycle must be used. An output guide is provided below. The values are approximate and must be adjusted downward if the fuse or circuit breaker trips off. Other loads on the circuit and fuse/circuit breaker characteristics will affect the available output. Do not exceed these welding conditions:
     
  3. Nov 20, 2016
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor

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    This is an inverter machine, specifically V205 AC/DC K 1855-1. The propaganda for the unit states "The 115/230V auto-reconnect makes the V205 AC/DC truely flexible and rugged..." It auto-reconnects for 115/230V 50/60hz input power.
    The unit is supplied with a cord with a 230V 6-50P cord end, and then a separate RV syle adapter over to 20A 115V.
    I have only used the unit a handfull of times on 230V, and don't trust the "automatic " voltage shuttle to 115V and back.
    There is no rewiring of the cord depending on voltage, only plugging in the RV style adapter to get to 115V (the ones with the horizontal blades).
    The unit is supposed to "sense" the supply voltage when plugged in, and shuttle the circuit internally to the proper voltage. Except, when it doesn't shuttle from 115 to 230 like its supposed to, the capacitors and motherboard inside explode/burn up.
    This is why I want to bypass this hokey feature. The Euro version on this unit is 230V only. The only advantage of 115V operation is the power output on 115V is 90-140V (for lighter materials), verses output on 230V is 184-276V.
    -Donny
     
  4. Nov 20, 2016
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

    St. Charles,...
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    Yeah I fully agree Donny.
    There's absolutely no sense to using 115 volts if you have 230 available.
    Be sure and let us know if you figure how to eliminate the 115 volt option.
    A quality 230 volts only inverter Tig is exactly what I am hoping to find.

    Is your V205T tig torch a flex head 17 or standard 17 ?
     
    cookieman likes this.
  5. Nov 20, 2016
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

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    Donny, as you know , standard line voltage in the US is 120/240 @ 60hz....................and you say that machine reconnects to 115/230 50-60hz......Not sure what is up with that machine , but obviously the 1855-1 has been discontinued and the re-branded Italian 'Selco" made machines as far as Lincoln is concerned seems to now be History............At one time a new board was available for that machine that I assume corrected it's voltage issues......I'm not sure re-wiring it would help without the board.
     
  6. Nov 21, 2016
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

    St. Charles,...
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  7. Nov 21, 2016
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

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    Lincolns offerings in that category seems to be very convoluted and confusing at best..........1855-1 and 2 being a UK machine that has dual power vs there latest offering in that category being a single voltage 230-240v machine K-2535-1? .................

    Personally , I'm a big Miller fan..........although I do own a Lincoln LN-25 that is by far the best in it's category of all direct current wire feed suitcase machines.........
    Do the Millers sometimes have problems? Yes they do...........but one thing that stands out far better than any welding manufactures , is the Miller support group (Welding Discussions - Miller Welding Discussion Forums) which is much like this site in it's depth of knowledge and is frequently visited by current and retired techs from Miller Welding.........not to say you'll get a definitive answer every time as to your machine's problems , as only good info IN gets good technical info OUT, and not to say that anyone that does not feel comfortable should be inside one of these machines that may have hot capacitors either............but in most cases what you will get is a systematic understanding of things to check with a multimeter and even some tips where to search for the cheapest replacement parts............
     
    Danefraz likes this.
  8. Nov 22, 2016
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor

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    It came with the standard 17. I also picked up a foot pedal control a couple months later. That thumb control just doesn't work for me. I bought the welder brand new, still sealed in plastic bags from a pawn shop up in Georgia a few years ago. Everything but a gas bottle and the foot control for $1050 out the door. They were asking $1500, but my brother saw it there a while earlier, so I made an offer. It a nice machine, but I'm real nervous each time I use it. It will stick weld too, but I haven't tried that option. I too prefer Miller products, which my MIG is, but for the money, thought it was a lot of machine for the money.
    -Donny
     
  9. Nov 23, 2016
    47v6

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    I bought this for 600 bucks a couple years ago
    [​IMG]
    Came with extra collets, tungstens both pure and thoriated and lots of rod, stainless, steel and aluminum. I know I stated this before. I just want you to see the size of an older unit. The older they are the bigger they come. The newer ones take up a lot less room. Space is at a premium for me. The guy I bought it from told me he could never get the hang of how to use it and pretty much rage sold it. I use it all the time. Still dont really know what I am doing, but the welds look pretty sometimes.
    [​IMG]
    I would like a newer machine, but just can't justify the expense for what I use it for.

    This one comes with a foot pedal and what you need to go weld Miller Diversion 180 TIG Welder 907627

    This one says it does everything and is basically the replacement for my unit. I think the spool gun is dubious to replace any MIG machine though Miller Syncrowave 210 TIG/MIG Complete 951616

    Buy this one and rage sell it to me. Miller Dynasty 210 Complete With Wireless Foot Control 951667
     
  10. Nov 23, 2016
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

    St. Charles,...
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    I recently saw a very nice condition vintage water cooled Linde (Union Carbide) HDA 300 Heliarc machine.
    It sold for $1200 with lots and lots of extras.
    I really had to bite the bullet to keep myself from buying that rig.
    I often ran one at work for aerospace junk and really liked them a lot.
    The old Linde 300 Heliarcs are about as big as a tig welder gets and they set the standard for professional tig welding just a few years back.
    But now these newfangled tiny little inverters have all kinds of slope control and sequencing features that I'll probably never need. Ha Ha Ha !

    Wow, now that was a screaming good deal.
    What ? It comes without a foot control ? Now that really stinks.

    I think I'll try to find a good deal on a used Miller Dynasty 200 DX.
    Besides it's US made and that makes me feel much better even if its a used rig.

    Now that's also a great deal too but i'm afraid a machine like that would ramp up too high on thin (20 guage) sheet.
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2016
  11. Nov 23, 2016
    47v6

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    I dont really know what I am doing, but I have had trouble on thin sheet. Doesn't like to work so very well. I chalked it up to my inexperience and lack of any training. It does work well and I can do a good job on thicker stuff. Thats pretty easy though.
     
  12. Nov 23, 2016
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

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    Yeah the main problem with most all of the cheaper units is inability to initiate arc at 5 amps or less.
    Otherwise they can be a great bargain for .045 / 16 gauge or thicker.
     
  13. Nov 23, 2016
    47v6

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    wow, that like welding air or spider silk or something. I did weld some CrMo .030 wall tube. not as easy as my skills would have it.
     
  14. Dec 3, 2016
    sieg

    sieg Sponsor

    bartonville IL
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    My son bought the harbor freight tig for our home Shop he tigs a lot at work with a lincoln. For $400 with a foot pedal he is quite happy how it works its 220 we also have a Hobart arc with no duty cycle and an ironman mig with spool gun .my son says the tig is easier for aluminum. He doesn't think the hft would hold up for every day use but for the home Shop he's happy. We have had a hft plasma cutter for 3 yrs no problems
     
  15. Dec 4, 2016
    montanacj

    montanacj Member

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    I had an invertor based tig from everlast with high frequency start. I had never tig welded and it was easy to get going with that hf start. I ended up returning the machine because the flow meter/regulator died in a week but aside from that it seemed like a decent machine for @500.

    In the end I got a millermatic 215 because I realized I was going to need a mig for several reasons but wanted the option of tig in the future. The 215 is a lift start tig, mig and stick and it's dual voltage.
     
  16. Dec 9, 2016
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

    St. Charles,...
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    I definitely need a TIG machine before next spring.
    Needed for both stainless and aluminum jeep repairs.

    At a minimum I will need to weld .045 through .1875 thicknesses.
    HF start and good foot pedal is a must for me.
    No torch control gas valves nor switches,,,, No thank You !
    Definitely wanting a pulse function for use thin stainless sheet metal.
    Definitely wanting Hertz tuning for penetration control on aluminum.
    Wanting AC balance control for cleaning action on aluminum.
    Prefer to have a flex head torch.
    Prefer pre and post flow gas control.

    The Squarewave 200 has all those features excepting the flow controls.
    So that machine will meet my minimum requirements.

    I came across a nice deal last night on a Lincoln 200 Squarewave for $1,100.
    So I made my decision based on my minimum requirements at a minimum cost.
    I also like the fact that it won't take up much space.
     
  17. Dec 9, 2016
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

    Northern California
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    I think you'll be fine with the Lincoln 200 based on your needs..........graduating into these later inverter machines adds a new level of welding education if you're going to use some of the added electronic benefits........

    I go to school daily trying some of the new techniques like AC Balance, pulse , changing the waveform via the hertz Etc,............Just got to try different things that work in the given application.....................while honestly some I see no visible change.................still learning.

    1/4" 60 series aluminum while changing settings
    [​IMG]
     
  18. Dec 10, 2016
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

    St. Charles,...
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    Welds Look O.K. Tarry.

    Shows lots of cleaning action.
    Meaning the AC balance looks to be ample for the application.
    You could probably raise the AC balance number some if you like.
    Raising the number will give less cleaning.
    This mainly depends on how old or dirty the aluminum is.

    Looks hot enough .
    Does not have a cold (piled up) bead appearance.
    Correct heat and frequency yields correct penetration.
    Bottom 3 welds ...
    Maybe a tad too hot or perhaps the frequency is a little high.
    But its hard to tell which one without seeing the penetration.

    But see how you have a small crater at the end of each weld ?
    You need to slowly ramp down the voltage during weld termination.
    Slow let off of the foot control will eliminate that crater effect.

    I'm already having second thoughts on my welder choice.
    I probably won't be happy if I can't control the post flow.
    That issue could get expensive real quick.
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2016
  19. Dec 10, 2016
    tarry99

    tarry99 Member

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    Going from a 1987 Miller Dial-Arc 250 HF transformer machine to the new Inverter style Dynasty 280 for me , was pretty much night and day in what I learned previously ...........and now pretty much worthless going forward. That was the very first welds I did after plugging everything in that evening with the new machine.........the initial settings were all over the electronic map and the welder is so much quieter than before........much better now after I have gotten allot more hours under the hood.

    If you're used to the old transformer machines...........you'll get and education also. Post up some pictures when you get your new machine up & running.
     
  20. Dec 11, 2016
    oldtime

    oldtime oldtime

    St. Charles,...
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    I'm really only used to running industrial type machines like the old water cooled Linde transformers.
    I certainly believe you're right about the night and day changes from transformer to inverters.

    I took my brand new machine apart today.
    Took a look inside to see If I could somehow reset the post flow timer.
    No reasonable chance of adjustment because the timer is part of the circuit board circuitry.
    So now I'm thinking about adding an external gas solenoid with a remote toggle switch.

    May not get around to using it before next spring and it will certainly be used stainless.
    Got a stainless exhaust I made for a 3B a couple years ago.
    Now I need to modify it for use with a PTO unit.
    Then I have some body repairs to do an a Jewels tub.
    I also have a Dauntless bellhousing crack to fix.

    Dynasty 280 sounds like a real nice versatile size machine.
    You have a water cooler for it ?
    I never ran a tig without water cooling this Lincoln 200 will be my first.
     
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