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Won't start when hot????

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by Sledgehammer, Mar 9, 2009.

  1. Mar 9, 2009
    Sledgehammer

    Sledgehammer Sure, I'll try it

    Ellery, Il
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
    Messages:
    341
    The flatty I just picked up is in great shape except for one little problem. When it is warmed up to running temp, (ie, been out for a drive and come back home) and you shut it off, it won't start again. When it cools off it will start perfectly. The engine won't turn over when it gets warm. The starter (new) just whines and won't engage the flywheel. The PO said he changed the starter and that did not fix the problem. Does anyone have an idea on the cause of this. All starter wires are tight and, without removing them, there doesn't appear to be any bad wires.

    Someone told me it might be too much advancement in the timing. Any merit to that?
     
  2. Mar 9, 2009
    bkd

    bkd Moderator Supreme Staff Member 2022 Sponsor

    K-Town Tenn.
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    Apr 29, 2007
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    sounds like a bad starter ,or solenoid to me
    Jim S.
     
  3. Mar 9, 2009
    Chilly

    Chilly Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2007
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    1,486
    So the starter just spins, little gear won't engage flywheel? That's a starter problem. No expert with old stuff but some old starters have a solenoid on the side that kicks the little drive gear onto the flywheel. Could be that the starter is fine but the solenoid isn't shoving the gear into the flywheel, if it's even that kind of starter arrangement.

    If the starter cranks and cranks and cranks the engine when hot then that's a different problem.
     
  4. Mar 9, 2009
    Sledgehammer

    Sledgehammer Sure, I'll try it

    Ellery, Il
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
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    341
    both are brand new, I know new parts can be faulty but the PO said it did the same think with the old starter also.
     
  5. Mar 9, 2009
    bkd

    bkd Moderator Supreme Staff Member 2022 Sponsor

    K-Town Tenn.
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    take the starter into Napa and have them check it :beer:
    Jim S.
     
  6. Mar 9, 2009
    Sledgehammer

    Sledgehammer Sure, I'll try it

    Ellery, Il
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
    Messages:
    341
    It spins and whines but the engine is not being turned over. I'll have to check the solenoid. He may have put on a new starter and swapped the old solenoid back in.
     
  7. Mar 9, 2009
    captain cj

    captain cj Member

    Crystal Beach...
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2005
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    331
    It is a starter problem. Try tapping the starter with a hammer. If it is not engaging the flywheel it has nothing to do with timing.
     
  8. Mar 9, 2009
    Sledgehammer

    Sledgehammer Sure, I'll try it

    Ellery, Il
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
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    341
    we tried the hammer trick and it did nothing.
     
  9. Mar 9, 2009
    BlueFlu

    BlueFlu past owner of some ecj5's

    Hermitage, TN
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2004
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    1,552
    You need to find a heat sheild for the starter.
    Replace the solenoid.
     
  10. Mar 9, 2009
    CJ-X

    CJ-X Member

    Ohio
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    Aug 6, 2006
    Messages:
    816
    Pull off the starter, hook it to a battery and see how it is working. Clean, Lube, and inspect. Probably something isn't perfect with the starter, and when it heats up, the problem worsens.
     
  11. Mar 9, 2009
    Patrick

    Patrick Super Moderator Staff Member

    Los Alamos, NM
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002
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    8,360
    Pull the starter and rotate the engine, look for a bad spot(s) on the ring gear.
    Maybe there's some stripped teeth and the starter doesn't engage as far when it's hot...
    Just something to check.
     
  12. Mar 9, 2009
    sammy

    sammy Coca-Cola?

    Albuquerque, NM
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    Jul 1, 2007
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    1,577
    Sounds broken beyond repair, I'll be right up to take the Jeep off of your hands.

    Just playing.
    Like everyone said check the starter. Mine did that and I ended up greasing the bendex and it worked like a charm.
     
  13. Mar 11, 2009
    DavidT

    DavidT New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
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    37
    I had a simmilar problem. I repaced solenoid and it still would not engage fly wheel. I gave the bendix a good shot of oil and it worked like a charm- for a few days, and I would have to re lube it again. After pulling the starter several times I decided to buy a new starter and save myself the trouble.
     
  14. Mar 11, 2009
    BlueFlu

    BlueFlu past owner of some ecj5's

    Hermitage, TN
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    I'm tellin ya Todd BIGGER HAMMER!!!
     
  15. Mar 12, 2009
    Sledgehammer

    Sledgehammer Sure, I'll try it

    Ellery, Il
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
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    The thought had crossed my mind......several times.

    I went through 3 solenoids and 2 starters last night with no luck. I put a brans new solenoid on the new starter and that just clicked but would not engage (when cold). As I was pulling the wires off the solenoid to drop the starter again the cap shattered in my hands. (JUNK) I got the starter that was pulled from my other JEEP and put it on the new one. It had two small shims on it the other starter did not have. When I tried that one it made the same clicking noise like the starter was not engaging the flywheel. I have a new problem now. I need to con a friend into coming over and cranking it so I can see what is going on. For some reason I can't crank it and look at the same time. I may pull it back off and put it in the vise and jump it if no one will come over. It's always the little things like this that torque me off the most. Starter: 2 bolts, 3 studs, all sorts of problems. Shouldn't be that hard.
     
  16. Mar 12, 2009
    LarryD

    LarryD Member

    Gallup NM/ 4 Corners
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    Sure sounds like a problem with the starter but sounds as if you have eliminated that as a possibility. That makes me think possibly battery cables next. I know you said they look OK but take the time to remove them and clean both ends and reassemble preferably with a little dielectric grease. How do you have the ground from the battery attached. I attach the battery ground to one of the starter mounting bolts then run a strap from the other starter bolt to the body.
    I also think a battery test is in order, ther is definetally a weak link in the chain.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2009
  17. Mar 12, 2009
    Wmi68CJ5

    Wmi68CJ5 Let the Sun Shine!

    Twin Lake MI
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    Aug 10, 2006
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    739
    I agree.

    This is kinda along the same line. When my alt wasn't juicing the battery enough when running I would shut off the engine and it would do the same thing. It would act like it was really cranking hard ie hot engine or sometimes is would just click. This was on my:v6:. I think you have an electrical problem if there are no flat spots on the flywheel.

    Good Luck and I feel for you man.

    Todd
     
  18. Mar 12, 2009
    Sledgehammer

    Sledgehammer Sure, I'll try it

    Ellery, Il
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
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    My battery is in the back on this one. I'll look at that. There are no missing teeth on the flywheel or starter gears. I think I'll put the new starter and new solenoid back on it tonight, then start checking wiring. I know it can't be much, prob a little knick in a wire or something that the PO did.

    I haven't had it long enough to tear it up. :)
     
  19. Mar 12, 2009
    BlueFlu

    BlueFlu past owner of some ecj5's

    Hermitage, TN
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    Pick up a remote starter switch at a FLAPS.

    Mine has been used many many times.

    Ya didn't tell me the batt was in the back. Cables may be to small or just bad.
     
  20. Mar 19, 2009
    Sledgehammer

    Sledgehammer Sure, I'll try it

    Ellery, Il
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2006
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    341
    I have replaced some other stuff on the new Jeep looking for the problem and still have no answers. I shimmed the starter from 0 to 100 thousandths and that did nothing. After that I tried replacing the fender mounted solenoid and checking/replacing all my grounds. Neither of those produced. Then, I chased wires looking for rubs, breaks, problems and came up empty handed. I pulled the starter back off and am going to remove all the shims and try again. This is getting old.
     
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